Another way of distributing Puppy?

Under development: PCMCIA, wireless, etc.
Message
Author
tlchost
Posts: 2057
Joined: Sun 05 Aug 2007, 23:26
Location: Baltimore, Maryland USA
Contact:

Re: using an image instead of ISO, i desesperate...

#21 Post by tlchost »

hamoudoudou wrote: some devs coming form Linux imagine than Puppy boys are so idiot that they never thought about installing Puppy from Windows.
Gawd forbid devs make it easy for windows users to get puppy up and running.
gyro
Posts: 1798
Joined: Tue 28 Oct 2008, 21:35
Location: Brisbane, Australia

#22 Post by gyro »

My mistake, I've just edited my last post, http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewto ... 557#999557, to indicate that the label of the fat32 partition should be "PUPBOOT", not "USBPUPPY".
This "PUPBOOT" label is used in both the "grub.cfg" and the "menu.lst" files contained in "pupboot.zip"

gyro
gyro
Posts: 1798
Joined: Tue 28 Oct 2008, 21:35
Location: Brisbane, Australia

#23 Post by gyro »

Given the size of a Puppy release file, I don't think many Puppy producers will be keen to upload a version more than once.
So whatever container file is used for Puppy, it needs to be easily useable on all platforms.
That's why I think it's unlikely that we will ever see many, if any, Puppies released as an installable windows '.exe' file.

gyro
User avatar
ally
Posts: 1957
Joined: Sat 19 May 2012, 19:29
Location: lincoln, uk
Contact:

#24 Post by ally »

User avatar
rcrsn51
Posts: 13096
Joined: Tue 05 Sep 2006, 13:50
Location: Stratford, Ontario

#25 Post by rcrsn51 »

gyro wrote:So whatever container file is used for Puppy, it needs to be easily useable on all platforms.
The simplest approach to this situation is to start building Puppy ISOs with Joliet extensions enabled. Then Windows can read them correctly.
gyro
Posts: 1798
Joined: Tue 28 Oct 2008, 21:35
Location: Brisbane, Australia

#26 Post by gyro »

@ally,
Oops, my statement was a little brash, and apparently, wrong.
But, (of course there has to be a "but"),
a solution that requires a separate release file for each platform, is not preferrable to a solution that requires just a single release file,
i.e. a zip file or an iso file.

gyro
gyro
Posts: 1798
Joined: Tue 28 Oct 2008, 21:35
Location: Brisbane, Australia

#27 Post by gyro »

@rcrsn51,
Why not stick with an iso file?

My assumption is that a windows user who wants to try Puppy Linux, is more and more likely to have a uefi machine with no optical drive, and want to boot Puppy from a usb device.
To do this, all they need is something that contains all the required files, ready to be copied to an empty usb stick.
No need for an image, or an mbr installer program, just a container with the required files, that can be easily extracted onto an empty usb stick, e.g. a zip file.
If it's just a container, why use a complicated one like an iso, if a simple one like a zip will do?

Also the zip solution I am suggesting contains a direct example of a simple frugal install.
Whereas the "boot" stuff in the iso is irrevelant to a simple frugal install.

gyro
User avatar
Burn_IT
Posts: 3650
Joined: Sat 12 Aug 2006, 19:25
Location: Tamworth UK

#28 Post by Burn_IT »

An ISO file is just like a zip file. It just uses a slightly different method of storing the files.
Most "zip" programs will unpack an ISO, even if the OS will not mount it directly - which most will nowadays.
"Just think of it as leaving early to avoid the rush" - T Pratchett
gyro
Posts: 1798
Joined: Tue 28 Oct 2008, 21:35
Location: Brisbane, Australia

#29 Post by gyro »

Burn_IT wrote:An ISO file is just like a zip file.
Sorry, it's not, a zip file is simply an archive, the equivalent in the Linux/Unix world is tar, not iso.
In the case of Puppy an iso is a bootable cd/dvd image.

Given the existence of an iso, we can treat it like an archive and simply extract the "Puppy" files we need for a frugal install.
But the "boot" files in the iso are those required to boot a cd/dvd, not those required for a frugal install.
So we cannot create a uefi bootable usb stick by simply "copying" files from an iso.

My suggestion is not just about the "format" of a Puppy release but also the content of the release.

gyro
User avatar
Burn_IT
Posts: 3650
Joined: Sat 12 Aug 2006, 19:25
Location: Tamworth UK

#30 Post by Burn_IT »

I did not say that it was anything to do with Linux or Windows or any OS.
I said it was LIKE a zip file in that it was a single file container for other files.
I deliberately left out the sometimes added bootable options. Not all ISO files have those options - in fact I suspect more don't than do.
The file format was designed originally for use on CD/DVD, but doesn't necessarily reside there.
"Just think of it as leaving early to avoid the rush" - T Pratchett
gyro
Posts: 1798
Joined: Tue 28 Oct 2008, 21:35
Location: Brisbane, Australia

#31 Post by gyro »

I've uploaded a new zip file, http://www.fishprogs.software/puppy/zip ... .05+13.zip.
It contains all that is needed to setup a bootable usb stick.

Windows process for uefi boot:

1. Download http://www.fishprogs.software/puppy/zip ... .05+13.zip (259 MiB).

2. Format usb stick, with "Volume label" of "USBPBOOT".

3. Unpack the zip file, in this case "upupbb-18.05+13.zip", into the empty usb stick.
Windows: Right click on the zip file, and select "Extract All...", and in the ensuing dialog select the empty root folder of the usb stick.
Puppy: Right click on the zip file, and select "XArchive archiver, "Select All", "Extract", then "choose" the empty root folder of the usb stick.

4. Boot the usb stick.

To enable a mbr/legacy boot, there is an extra step:

Windows: Execute "utils\win\grubinst_gui.exe" within the usb stick.
Puppy: Execute "utils/lin/grubinst_gui.sh" within the usb stick.

Note: I intend to delete all previous files uploaded in this project, soon.

gyro
gyro
Posts: 1798
Joined: Tue 28 Oct 2008, 21:35
Location: Brisbane, Australia

#32 Post by gyro »

In case there is someone interested in how this latest zip file works, but is daunted by a 259MiB download,
I have uploaded "puppy_usb_stick.zip" (1 MiB) to http://www.mediafire.com/folder/7y3c7eafptzao/zipboot.
This zip file contains everything execpt the actual Puppy files. i.e. the "puppy/" directory is empty.
So the process will work as per the instructions of the previous post, execpt that when you come to boot the usb stick, the bootloader will not be able to find the kernel because the "vmlinuz" file does not exist.

You could make it work, by copying "vmlinuz", "initrd.gz" and all the ".sfs" files from some existing woof-ce based frugal install into the "puppy/" directory on the usb stick.

gyro
Last edited by gyro on Wed 24 Apr 2019, 14:05, edited 1 time in total.
gyro
Posts: 1798
Joined: Tue 28 Oct 2008, 21:35
Location: Brisbane, Australia

#33 Post by gyro »

A new version of "puppy_usb_stick.zip" has been uploaded to http://www.mediafire.com/folder/7y3c7eafptzao/zipboot.
Please see previous post for details about this file.

gyro
gyro
Posts: 1798
Joined: Tue 28 Oct 2008, 21:35
Location: Brisbane, Australia

#34 Post by gyro »

All remaining files for this project are now available at http://www.mediafire.com/folder/7y3c7eafptzao/zipboot.

The script 'iso2zip' is stored as 'iso2zip.zip' so that it's execute attribute is maintained. After downloading, you will need to 'unzip' it to reproduce the script.

gyro
musher0
Posts: 14629
Joined: Mon 05 Jan 2009, 00:54
Location: Gatineau (Qc), Canada

#35 Post by musher0 »

Many thanks, gyro.

I'll try your script for bundling a thumbdrive-ready package when my Puduan-7 is ready.

Best.
musher0
~~~~~~~~~~
"You want it darker? We kill the flame." (L. Cohen)
gyro
Posts: 1798
Joined: Tue 28 Oct 2008, 21:35
Location: Brisbane, Australia

#36 Post by gyro »

musher0 wrote:I'll try your script for bundling a thumbdrive-ready package when my Puduan-7 is ready.
Great.
Just remember that if unzipping directly to a usb stick, the usb stick must have a volume label of "USBPBOOT" (without the quotes).

And when you do, I'll try installing your Puduan-7 '.zip' file.

gyro
musher0
Posts: 14629
Joined: Mon 05 Jan 2009, 00:54
Location: Gatineau (Qc), Canada

#37 Post by musher0 »

gyro wrote:
musher0 wrote:I'll try your script for bundling a thumbdrive-ready package when my Puduan-7 is ready.
Great.
Just remember that if unzipping directly to a usb stick, the usb stick must have a volume label of "USBPBOOT" (without the quotes).

And when you do, I'll try installing your Puduan-7 '.zip' file.

gyro
:)
musher0
~~~~~~~~~~
"You want it darker? We kill the flame." (L. Cohen)
gyro
Posts: 1798
Joined: Tue 28 Oct 2008, 21:35
Location: Brisbane, Australia

#38 Post by gyro »

musher0 wrote::)
I appreciate you trying the script, but I just thought of a couple of issues.

1. For the script to work, you also need to download 'puppy_usb_stick.zip' from http://www.mediafire.com/folder/7y3c7eafptzao/zipboot and store it in the same directory as the script, (no need to unzip this file, the 'iso2zip' script uses it as a '.zip').

2. The boot entry in the generated 'menu.lst'/'grub.cfg' is generic, and not customised for the particular Puppy stored in the output '.zip'. (I am working on this.)

Yes, the script should work, but I think I should include a "complete package" in the 'iso2zip.zip', not just the script.

gyro
gyro
Posts: 1798
Joined: Tue 28 Oct 2008, 21:35
Location: Brisbane, Australia

#39 Post by gyro »

For now, I've uploaded a new version of 'iso2zip.zip' to http://www.mediafire.com/folder/7y3c7eafptzao/zipboot.
It still contains only the script, so you still need 'puppy_usb_stick.zip' as well.

This version customises the sub-directory and title of the boot entry to reflect the Puppy that the '.zip' contains.
This makes it a better template for adding more Puppies to the usb stick.

gyro
gyro
Posts: 1798
Joined: Tue 28 Oct 2008, 21:35
Location: Brisbane, Australia

#40 Post by gyro »

i've uploaded a new version of 'bionicpup32-8.0+3-uefi.zip' to http://www.mediafire.com/folder/7y3c7eafptzao/zipboot, generated with the new 'iso2zip' script.

Since it's only a matter of a nicer boot entry, there's not much value in downloading it again if you have already done so.

gyro
Post Reply