I have a my own WoofCE build of a Bionic64 Puppy pretty well setup for Audio, Graphics and Video editing. It can even run and use the OpenShot-v2.5.1-x86_64.AppImage out of the box as well as the Openshot 2.4.1 from PPM - besides of the use of KdenLive.
Tried out the GrandOrgue and found it being totally crappy. So, why messing around with such a crappy program when there's so much different, good and easy to use Synthesizers and Organs like Yoshimi and ZynAddSubFx?
Both of them come with lots of different sound files as well as there is great Organ sounds for both of them. From the KX Studio repositories one can also download ZynAddSubFx 3.0.5 Fusion.
Then there's e.g. SetBFree Organ Simulation in PPM wich can be used as standalone program or as lv2 plugin for DAWs like Qtractor etc.
So, why messing around and wasting time on such a crappy GrandOrgue program?
Grandorgue (midi instrument sampler) on Bionicpup64?
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O.F.I.N.S.I.S.
- Posts: 159
- Joined: Sun 01 Mar 2020, 16:17
There is human speech.
And there is electronic imitation of human speech.
For example:
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/ ... nglish.ogg
from:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ESpeak
Real human speech is a very complicated and mathematically imperfect sound, which is difficult to analyze. Simple speech software like espeak can produce sounds somewhat like real human speech, but the end result is far from a perfect imitation.
Another approach to produce human speech using software is to simply record real human beings speaking and playing back the appropriate recording at the appropriate time. Many telephone automatic interactive answering systems do this. Like when you phone a large company like a bank, or IBM or any government office. The voices sound like a real human being because they are actual recordings of real human beings. As opposed to the unrealistic sound produced by espeak. There is nothing wrong with espeak, it produces intelligible speech efficiently. It just sounds very electronic and artificial.
"Organ" sounds produced by synthesis methods also tend to sound very electronic and artificial. It is difficult to produce sounds using software that is realistic. If you record each sound that a real pipe organ can make, and play the sounds back at the appropriate time (when you press a key on your midi keyboard) the sound will be as good as the recording of the originals. Which is about as realistic as you can get.
Most competent musicians using GrandOrgue would want a sound that is as realistic as possible, that is, they want a sound that is exactly like what they would hear if they were playing a real pipe organ. Artifiicial sound created by frequency synthesis does not sound realistic to them.
GrandOrgue uses samplesets, which are recordings of each key of each stop/voice of a real pipe organ. So the sound is as good as the recording, and can be very realistic.
And the samplesets are often recordings of real pipe organs that are considered to be especially fine musical instruments, made by, for example Willis, Hill, Norman and Beard, Cavaillé-Coll, etc.
GrandOrgue is free open source software like the commercial Hauptwerk software. For example, you can purchase Hauptwerk for 500 euros and buy the Salisbury Cathedral sampleset for 1,500 euros. Or you can use GrandOrgue for free and use some of the free samplesets that are available.
SetBFree Organ Simulation is an imitation of Hammond drawbar electronic "organs". Most users of GrandOrgue probably do not want the Hammond organ sound, which does not much sound like a real pipe organ.
By the way, Aeolus
https://kokkinizita.linuxaudio.org/linuxaudio/aeolus/
is a software imitation of pipe organs for Linux using frequency synthesis.
And there is electronic imitation of human speech.
For example:
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/ ... nglish.ogg
from:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ESpeak
Real human speech is a very complicated and mathematically imperfect sound, which is difficult to analyze. Simple speech software like espeak can produce sounds somewhat like real human speech, but the end result is far from a perfect imitation.
Another approach to produce human speech using software is to simply record real human beings speaking and playing back the appropriate recording at the appropriate time. Many telephone automatic interactive answering systems do this. Like when you phone a large company like a bank, or IBM or any government office. The voices sound like a real human being because they are actual recordings of real human beings. As opposed to the unrealistic sound produced by espeak. There is nothing wrong with espeak, it produces intelligible speech efficiently. It just sounds very electronic and artificial.
"Organ" sounds produced by synthesis methods also tend to sound very electronic and artificial. It is difficult to produce sounds using software that is realistic. If you record each sound that a real pipe organ can make, and play the sounds back at the appropriate time (when you press a key on your midi keyboard) the sound will be as good as the recording of the originals. Which is about as realistic as you can get.
Most competent musicians using GrandOrgue would want a sound that is as realistic as possible, that is, they want a sound that is exactly like what they would hear if they were playing a real pipe organ. Artifiicial sound created by frequency synthesis does not sound realistic to them.
GrandOrgue uses samplesets, which are recordings of each key of each stop/voice of a real pipe organ. So the sound is as good as the recording, and can be very realistic.
And the samplesets are often recordings of real pipe organs that are considered to be especially fine musical instruments, made by, for example Willis, Hill, Norman and Beard, Cavaillé-Coll, etc.
GrandOrgue is free open source software like the commercial Hauptwerk software. For example, you can purchase Hauptwerk for 500 euros and buy the Salisbury Cathedral sampleset for 1,500 euros. Or you can use GrandOrgue for free and use some of the free samplesets that are available.
SetBFree Organ Simulation is an imitation of Hammond drawbar electronic "organs". Most users of GrandOrgue probably do not want the Hammond organ sound, which does not much sound like a real pipe organ.
By the way, Aeolus
https://kokkinizita.linuxaudio.org/linuxaudio/aeolus/
is a software imitation of pipe organs for Linux using frequency synthesis.
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O.F.I.N.S.I.S.
- Posts: 159
- Joined: Sun 01 Mar 2020, 16:17
@williams2
Yes, I can understand that some people/musicians might prefer sounds from a real pipe organ. But if one wants to have and use true realistic pipe organ sounds, the only way is to play and record a real pipe organ. Everything recorded digital is based on reduced data - no matter what sample frequency is used.
Best sounds to be recorded ever still is analogue recording on good tapes and tape machines in very high speed. On just can't compare this to digital sounds/samples.
However: from reading the whole topic and trying out the offered .sfs file as well as other downloads, this GrandOrgue doesn't seem to be made and/or usable in Puppy Linux. Probably this would work better in Ubuntu Studio or even AV Linux Studio.
So, to me it still looks crappy for Puppy Linux and therefor a waste of time!
Yes, I can understand that some people/musicians might prefer sounds from a real pipe organ. But if one wants to have and use true realistic pipe organ sounds, the only way is to play and record a real pipe organ. Everything recorded digital is based on reduced data - no matter what sample frequency is used.
Best sounds to be recorded ever still is analogue recording on good tapes and tape machines in very high speed. On just can't compare this to digital sounds/samples.
However: from reading the whole topic and trying out the offered .sfs file as well as other downloads, this GrandOrgue doesn't seem to be made and/or usable in Puppy Linux. Probably this would work better in Ubuntu Studio or even AV Linux Studio.
So, to me it still looks crappy for Puppy Linux and therefor a waste of time!
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[b]My own build of Bionic64[/b]
This is a recording of a Trumpet tune played using Hauptwerk.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j6MPquYmRnI
GrandOrgue is a free open source alternative to Hauptwerk.
Not quite as good.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j6MPquYmRnI
GrandOrgue is a free open source alternative to Hauptwerk.
Not quite as good.
This is Piotr Grabowski's Giubiasco free sample set for Hauptwerk and GrandOrgue:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=44ZZxLhvotc
This IS the GrandOrgue software.
The Giubiasco sampleset is larger than a gig, maybe larger than 2G.
The demo sampleset included with the GrandOrgue package is about 21MB.
Edit: Actually, I'm not sure if that is GrandOrgue or Hauptwerk. They sound about the same, using the same sampleset.
This definitely is GrandOrgue, not Hauptwerk:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lSVXAANTWe4
.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=44ZZxLhvotc
This IS the GrandOrgue software.
The Giubiasco sampleset is larger than a gig, maybe larger than 2G.
The demo sampleset included with the GrandOrgue package is about 21MB.
Edit: Actually, I'm not sure if that is GrandOrgue or Hauptwerk. They sound about the same, using the same sampleset.
This definitely is GrandOrgue, not Hauptwerk:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lSVXAANTWe4
.
I added a few .ogg recordings of GrandOrgue that I made to the archive.org page.
https://archive.org/details/grand-orgue ... .0-x-86-64
https://archive.org/details/grand-orgue ... .0-x-86-64