Puppy is mentioned here - what b*ll*cks!

[linuxcbon]

The aggressive reactions of many "linux lovers" is a shame.

[Artie]

I agree linuxcbon. If I had been an editor of a computer magazine and he had submitted this article to me for review I wouldn't even have considered publishing it but adviced counselling.

Artie

[Trobin]

Well I am a member of the Linux community he hasn't alienated. Maybe it is because Linux, even Puppy Linux, hasn't been a bed of roses. At least not in my experience.

Would I use Linux in a business. If I started the business using Linux.

Would I, as a business owner, switch from MS to Linux. No.
Unless..
1..There was a readily available source for help. Someone here said go to the friendly forums. I've been on a few that wwere definitely not friendly. Also would the time needed to search the forum, for an answer, be more cost effective than picking up a phone and calling a help line.
2..I could be sure that Linux would work with my peripherals as easily and as well as MS. I have a Canon printer. There are no linux drivers for it. So if I were to go to Linux completely then I would have to go out and buy a new printer. If I have to keep MS to run that printer why switch?
3..If I had some staff that would be using the computer(s) would they be comfrtable making the sqwitch from MS to Linux.

Using linux doesn't cost me anything, because I don't run a business. I can take the time to fiddle around and get things working. But if I were running a business the time, and money lost, making the transition and getting everything to work, purchasing new equipment, etc. would have to be a consideration. Microsoft might be cheaper.

[Trobin]

quote Linxcbon

The aggressive reactions of many "linux lovers" is a shame.

quote Artie

I agree linuxcbon. If I had been an editor of a computer magazine and he had submitted this article to me for review I wouldn't even have considered publishing it but adviced counselling.

Artie

[puppyluvr]

Hello,

The aggressive reactions of many "linux lovers" is a shame.

I dont believe I reacted aggressivly, but rather defencivly.
I did not attack the man personally, nor the Legal profession in general, ( Too easy)
I reacted to HIS attack on Linux, and the Linux community in general.
I am certain this is not the only Linux forum reacting to his article..
Ill bet his email box is "Blowing up "

Yet if the man posted here for help, (and was courtious about it), I would gladly spend my time and effort to help him all I could, and would even turn to others to ask for their help as well. As happens here daily. For my time I would recieve?....The gratification of knowing Ive helped someone.
Coming from a profession where "Time is money", would he appreciate it???

If a computer magazine wrote an article ( unjustifiably) attacking his profession, mentioning his office by name, would he, as a Lawyer, offer to help correct their misconceptions, giving of his own time, for free????
Or would he sue them???

That is the Linux community of which he wrote so dispairingly.

[Auda]

If you read what he has written with and unbiased mind its all basicly true. I have been installing ubuntu for a few days so far and it still isnt right. Windows xp took a couple of hours including office its finished and works fine. Sure liunx is "better" and free but where time is money what would ubuntu have cost comparied to xp ? At $20 per hour ubuntu so far $480, xp comes with the computer for an extra $120 including office. And people know how to use it !
Hmm I think he has got it right, now back to installing KDE on edubuntu.
Auda

[raffy]

If someone states outrageous claims, of course what could you feel but ... ?

In the "battle for the future (of OS)" expect a dagger in every corner and shadow, and some fellows who wear the same hat, but preaching the glories of the other side.

(Even typos can be made big-time issues in this tortuous battle.)

Alas, truth is evasive. Have you recently come across a nun (a school admin) willing to discuss only Micro$oft ? I have. Articles like that can help shape such behavior.

But truth can come out. Just in the other room (of this office), there is a legal clerk helping out in every Linux problem that adjoining offices encounter (luckily, there was only one problem in only one PC since February 2008). Alas, the writer (Rod Kovel) did not have help from this humble clerk.

[cthisbear]

Auda

" Windows xp took a couple of hours including office its finished
and works fine. "

///////////////////

Sorry....BS moment.
Nothing personal....yeah working fine...for how long?
Tell you what...How long.....Sweet FA.

Did you make a backup.
Most people update....I never go past service pack 2.
Your AV....hows that going....ad infinitum?

Oh! By the way.
Did you install XP while your network cable was still plugged?
Bad luck....you're probably infected already....under 30 seconds now
I believe. Used to be 2 minutes.

There's some sort of plague...virus...going around...
some call it Gordo ? ....nothing boots.
Puppy can see it....but Windows is dead in the water.

And Vista....don't get me started.
Boofhead was a genius compared to these clowns.
Four times the size of XP.
For what.....a joke.
Crap performance.....goes down in weeks and less.

I like Minisys Muppy 08....but newer Sata drives cannot be seen.
Probably an easy fix.
But how good is Mark?

And Barry.....I'm not going to wash his feet....but he's good.

As is anyone else who produced any Puplets etc.
And there has been a bounty of great releases for the last
few years. Not all are what I want or need.
But variety, flavour, adventure, breathtaking.
I give my thanks to all your effort and toil.

And then we have Plod that you pay for. Music that's never yours.
An OS that's never yours.
Is it OEM or is it that...you can't put it on this cpmputer,
or you can.....no...it's a different motherboard.

Please feel free to read pages 1 & 2 of this next Whirlpool post
before they delete. it./....when boredom overtakes you.

http://forums.whirlpool.net.au/forum-re ... ?t=1016010

But wait there's more

http://whirlpool.net.au/wiki/?tag=Windows_XP_Licensing

http://forums.whirlpool.net.au/forum-re ... ?t=1031226


Bloody Windows.
I'm still using Puppy 1.07.....off and on.
Just added bookmarks....Scroogle for opening the web
and some codecs.
Still working great.
Yeah! the security might not be so good as with the latest browsers,
but still working....as scratchy as that CD is.
Working better than XP or Vista....every day.

Here's what you'll need soon.
Bookmark it....get out your Puppy to fix it.
It's only a matter of time.

http://forums.whirlpool.net.au/forum-re ... ?t=1030029

Chris.

[cthisbear]

http://www.puppylinux.org/community/blo ... appy-puppy

" I've installed Puppy Linux 4.0 (Dingo). I like it. A lot.
It has really impressed me, and I'm difficult to impress."

Saw this on tuxmachines.org/

http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/29409 but it wasactually on

our own blog.

http://www.puppylinux.org/community/blo ... appy-puppy

" I think that Puppy's real strength will be a flagship distro for
advocacy of GNU/Linux. '

/////////////////////////////////////////

Lawyers and advice.
Does that mix...let alone work?

Chris.

[otropogo]

I'm having a very unpleasant flashback to the days when IBM's OS/2 was writhing in its final agonies, after the disastrous release of OS/2 Warp.

Even the mildest criticism evoked unrestrained volleys of verbal abuse from the OS/2 zealots. The substance of carefully enunciated problems was ignored and countered by foul language and attacks on the intelligence and integrity of the complainant and anyone who agreed with him even partially.

I fervently hope that the vulgar ad hominem attacks, the pathetic posturing, and the seemingly infectuous frothing at the mouth this thread has produced do not presage a similar collapse of Puppy.

[KF6SNJ]

otropogo,

I don't think that likely. True, OS2/Warp4 has its quirks, but it is still a fairly solid operating system, especially in comparision to windows. I think amongst puppy users, the issue here is that some feel as though they are being unfairly attacked by a relatively biased individual who it would seem did not truly take the time try to ask a fairly large and knowledgable user base for help. It may even be that his goal was to shortchange puppy and in effect discredit linux as a whole. Truthfully, all he accomplished was to aggitate a few dedicated users and demonstrate a certain level of unfamiliarity and potential hostility towards linux. I can forgive ignorance, however, I think the author really did not take the time to do enough proper research. I suspect that most likely it will hurt his credibility, save for what little he may have amongst the M$ crowd.

[Auda]

cthisbear
Yep, most of what you say is correct. I make and image of xp as soon as it finishes installing and one every time I install a new programme

Did you install XP while your network cable was still plugged?
Bad luck....you're probably infected already....under 30 seconds now
I believe. Used to be 2 minutes.

Are you sure about these figures ? Where did you get them ? Its not a problem here the house sits behind a Freesco firewall.

And Vista....don't get me started

I wont start on it either, however I suspect that I will have to start installing it soon, not by choice !

I'm still using Puppy 1.07.....off and on.

I'm slightly more modern that you I use 109ce every day and so does everyone else in the house I wont let windows have access to the outside world but its good for the kids to play games on. My son calls it "Olim lotum erat" stale urine.

I'm not a windows fan but I do know what reality is. In a business setting you find windows on the desk top for a good reason it works (well enough) and people know how to use it.

Linux on the other hand not so easy, I installed ubuntu added edubuntu and then KDE not so hard sort of standard I get an error on startup "ipc server cant connect" or some such on the first boot after 6 boots it comes up 6 times 12, 12 times and Joe Blow is suposed to be able to sort it out.
Ubuntu is a big disrto and it doesnt work. xp does.

That is my point. I dont like it though.

Auda

[Flash]

Otropogo,

There have been a number of forum discussions which got as bad as this one, yet Puppy is still here. I suppose that's a tribute to Barry's genius of vision and hard work, and the hard work of a lot of other people too numerous to list.

It's just too bad that the guy who started this discussion probably doesn't even know about it.

[shroomy_bee]

otropogo - you seem to be doing here what some others are trying on me elsewhere.

If you really thought that poster was nitpicking, then you yourself wouldn't have posted the types of replies you have that are picking up on all kinds of smallish concerns.

And puppyluvr - that kind of thing is what I meant by a dangerous attitude in letting them get away with that kind of behaviour. They'll use it to suck your soul into mindless back-and-forths, and they never bother reading what you actually type because their objective is only to argue and get an emotional reaction, to feed their 4D archon masters.

[Lobster]

If someone tries Puppy and it does not work
it gets a score of zero for usability.
(what score would you give it?)

I had this problem with Mepis - how wonderful it was (so I heard)
Tried it several times - nada - nothing did not work on my system.
Eventually it did work out of the box (it was OK -nothing to write home about)

On the whole I now find Linux is quicker and more efficient at installing on hardware than Windows.

If Windows works for someone, good luck to them.
If Puppy does not run maybe it can be sorted but many, in fact most people will not bother.
They also expect all the software to always work and never crash.
Unreasonable these end users . . .

Now there are parts of Puppy that have been unstable at various times
JWM was unstable when we first used it
Firefox became unstable in the 2.xx series
The latest Flash in Seamonkey is not 100%

To the end user - the browser crashes in Youtube - Puppy does not work . . .
Unreasonable?
Sure. Human beings are noted for that . . .

Or to give you another example (have not tried it lately)
Abiword OK for docs up to about 20 pages - then it becomes unstable
- you need OpenOffice

However when Puppy works faster on dinosaur equipment
than Vista on the latest malware infested hardware
we are happy - and rightly so.

Windows users put up with terrible problems
but also find many advantages.
Of course we can dual boot or run Puppy from CD on a Windows machine.
We have cake and we happily eat it.

I prefer Puppy. It works for me.
Recently Barry was kind enough to compile the latest Alpha 4.1 so it
worked on my hardware.
MS does not offer me that level of service or expertise.

Puppy works well. it works fast. It is fun.
The latest Slackware compatible Muppy would be a great asset to this lawyer.
Again I believe Mark would be willing to support any problems
and maybe even write specialised software.

It might even be possible to have a puplet just for lawyers . . .
maybe with a custom 'sue' icon but that is another story . . .

The Sufis have a saying:
''The greatest revenge on an enemy - is to make them your friend'
Personally I would rather have them as an enemy - along with sharks.

[otropogo]

otropogo - you seem to be doing here what some others are trying on me elsewhere.

You have just demonstrated the quintessential hit and run attack. How is one to respond to the above accusation? What has your post contributed to understanding anything?

If you really thought that poster was nitpicking, then you yourself wouldn't have posted the types of replies you have that are picking up on all kinds of smallish concerns.

You appear to understand what "nitpicking" means, so your post is clearly a disingenuous attempt to characterize me as a liar or a hypocrite.

In other words, it is an ad hominem attack with no other purpose than to discredit the arguments of a poster by casting doubt on his integrity.

This goes beyond offenses against netiquette. Your post is an odious attempt to stifle the free exchange of ideas by insult and inuendo.

[otropogo]

duplicate posting removed by edit

[prehistoric]

The latest Slackware compatible Muppy would be a great asset to this lawyer.
Again I believe Mark would be willing to support any problems
and maybe even write specialised software.

What has MU done to you to deserve this fate?

Seriously, this problem turns up every time someone compares Linux to Windows as a product. Linux is not the trademark of a commercial product, though many suppliers of commercial products use Linux. (BTW: Should we tell the attorney his router may be running the dreaded Linux OS?) It is easy to see that it fails in this comparison, without turning on a computer. All you need to do is walk into a store and examine the software offered for sale.

Without following all the digressions and personal comments above, I sense something wrong at this point in a discussion. Can someone tell me what it is?

[otropogo]

...
Without following all the digressions and personal comments above, I sense something wrong at this point in a discussion. Can someone tell me what it is?

You've been told, and more than once. You just don't want to listen...

[puppyluvr]

Hello,
Well, I thought it was just me, but now I see you attacking others, as well.
Eloquent, aggresive, prone to twisting things to suit your point.
Using phrases like "ad hominem", " discredit the arguments", and "odious attempt to stifle" HMMM, I think the picture is getting clearer....Are you, by any chance,.... a Lawyer???

This all started over an article which you defended wholeheartedly. (succinct and fair, remember) and which we disagree with. IDK where you are from, but here on the "Internets" free speech runs rampant..
You are allowed to express your opinions.
You are not allowed to attack others for their opinions.
Although it may have been said that the man is either misinformed or an idiot, no one has implied you are an idiot for defending him. Maybe a "zombie"...( A joke, please, no tirade")
Your thinly veiled insults (Eloquent insults are still insults) notwithstanding, no one here has insulted you.
We say he is wrong, and we can prove it. Many even made suggestions and linked to posts concerning Linux doing EXACTLY what he said it wont.

I fervently hope that the vulgar ad hominem attacks, the pathetic posturing, and the seemingly infectuous frothing at the mouth this thread has produced do not presage a similar collapse of Puppy.

So Stop.....
After all, you are the "netiquette" police..