Damn Small Linux complaint...

Message

Woof Woof Brysche · #81 Post by **Woof Woof Brysche** » Mon 22 Mar 2010, 00:01

daftdog wrote:R.I.P...free speech.

Lol, now I need to go to the DSL forums to apologize!

racepres · #82 Post by **racepres** » Mon 22 Mar 2010, 00:41

Woof Woof Brysche wrote: Lol, now I need to go to the DSL forums to apologize!

Nooo. Heck w/ 'em!! Fun to see how many folks have used and still consider DSL Viable.
Anytime someone can generate the traffic that this topic has, It can't be a Bad Thing..
RP

daftdog · #83 Post by **daftdog** » Mon 22 Mar 2010, 07:38

daftdog wrote:

R.I.P...free speech.

Woof Woof Brysche wrote:

Lol, now I need to go to the DSL forums to apologize!

No, it was not my intention for you to do this. I was trying to support you against others who think they can issue orders or they have some sort of moral high ground (people who themselves post offensive content on this forum). I don't necessarily agree with what you wrote but you have the right to express it.

Colonel Panic · #84 Post by **Colonel Panic** » Mon 22 Mar 2010, 09:41

Assuming that was aimed at me (and perhaps others);

@daftdog; no one's issuing orders and I at least am not defending my "right" to post offensively. Moral high ground? I don't know.

Free speech? Sure. I'm disappointed by what Zenwalk's turned into recently (at least as far as my own machine is concerned) and have posted here and the Vector forum saying so, but there's a difference between a single post on a thread somewhere expressing that disappointment and a whole thread here devoted to slagging off a distro and its community who aren't here to defend themselves.

Would you like it if you saw another distro's forum where someone had started a thread saying how terrible Puppy and its community were?

daftdog · #85 Post by **daftdog** » Mon 22 Mar 2010, 14:15

Don't panic Colonel Panic, I wasn't writing about you. People in this thread are issuing orders, the whole thread is not slagging off DSL and there are plenty of places where others on other forums have expressed their dislike/disappointment with Puppy (obviously you don't get out much).

racepres · #86 Post by **racepres** » Tue 23 Mar 2010, 03:46

daftdog wrote:there are plenty of places where others on other forums have expressed their dislike/disappointment with Puppy

Go to "linux forums" and post anything about how running as root aint so bad... Seen them threads locked in no time flat.
Just an example.
RP
Edited :
It was linux forums, Not Linux Questions.
Sorry for any confusion

KF6SNJ · #87 Post by **KF6SNJ** » Tue 23 Mar 2010, 04:04

I've tried DSL. Can't say I liked it much. It often seemed to take too long to load once it was installed. Also, installing it was a bit of a bear.

That being said, it has its good points too. However, that can also be said of almost any other distro out there, including Puppy.

In all honesty, I have come to find that Puppy is one of the (if not the) easiest of Linux distros to use. I started using Puppy back around 0.7 or 0.8. I have tried other distros since then, but I keep coming back to Puppy. Puppy consistently meets my expectations for a Linux distro. This coming from a guy that got started in Linux with Red Hat 6.

I suppose that DSL has its place in the world of Linux, but I don't believe that it will ever come close to matching the elegance and efficiency that is Puppy.

Colonel Panic · #88 Post by **Colonel Panic** » Tue 23 Mar 2010, 13:12

Agreed. I've tried DSL too, but I didn't much like the appearance and couldn't get the ppp dialup configuration to work.

It's good that it works on low-resource machines but there are also low-resource versions of Puppy (I know of three; Turbo. Turbo Extreme and PULP) which need fewer resources to run properly than standard Puppy does and would be my first "port of call" if I had a really old by today's standards (i.e. 20th century) computer.

Colonel Panic · #89 Post by **Colonel Panic** » Tue 23 Mar 2010, 13:29

There was also a (British) derivative of DSL called Feather Linux, which I ran for a short while. It's obsolete now though (it hasn't been updated since 2006 and I was one of the very last people to post on its forum), but it did work pretty well for the time.

If anyone's interested, here's the link;

http://featherlinux.berlios.de/

#90 Post by **ttuuxxx** » Tue 23 Mar 2010, 13:37

Colonel Panic wrote:There was also a (British) derivative of DSL called Feather Linux, which I ran for a short while. It's obsolete now though (I was one of the very last people to post on its forum), but it did work pretty well for the time.

If anyone's interested, here's the link;

http://featherlinux.berlios.de/

kind of like this dragonfly Linux developer making turtle Linux, its a small Linux 300mb area, he makes all these great comments about it but it wouldn't even boot on my system, lol
http://kevux.org/turtle/about.html
ttuuxxx

Colonel Panic · #91 Post by **Colonel Panic** » Tue 23 Mar 2010, 13:54

Ttuuxxx, that's interesting but you never know in the long term what might come of a project like that if someone else picks it up and decides to run with it.

BTW, Feather Linux was based on Knoppix, not DSL (at least not directly). My bad.

#92 Post by **Pizzasgood** » Wed 24 Mar 2010, 02:05

Caved wrote:This reminds me of a very old linux distro that was dilliberatly made very freaking hard to install and run at all. (think about linux from scratch, wy would that have a userbase or develloppers at all?)

What do you mean? Why wouldn't Linux From Scratch have a userbase? When you compile everything yourself, you have full control over the system. Even more so than if you went with Gentoo. With Gentoo you compile from source as well, but you're tied into Portage. That means you have to have Python whether you want it or not. (Nothing against Python, but it is good to have choice.) Being tied into Portage also means you have to be more careful to maintain compatibility with it so you don't break anything.

Linux From Scratch, on the other hand, is a book. It's a guide. It shows you how to make your own Linux system from scratch. There is plenty of room to do things your way.

The end result is that you get a system that has exactly the things you want, and that you compiled yourself so that it can have exactly the compiler flags you want and be aimed at exactly the architecture you want.

It takes a lot of work. But for many people it is worth it for the reward.

Now, in my case, I used Linux From Scratch as a learning method. That's really what it's about in the end. I'm making my own distro from scratch, but as a starting point I followed the LFS book. Today I finished automating the build process (myself, not by using their automated system). Tomorrow I will improve my automation to make it more robust and useful. Then I can start moving on and making the distro into something unique.

Besides, where do you think distros come from? Do you think we just magically know how to create new Linuxes? Or that they are all derived from eachother remaster-style? LFS exists for the future distro creators.

Woof Woof Brysche wrote:DSL is ugly as hell.

I have never used DSL. But, I was around back in the days when Puppy was about 46 MB (version 0.9.1 or so was the first version I tried, and I had adopted it as my main OS by version 0.9.8 ). And let me tell you, back then we didn't have anything on DSL graphics-wise. We were ugly as all get-out. There were some prettier puplets (like Pizzapup

), but official Puppies were not at all attractive for a long time.

Regarding running on old hardware, some people like doing it just for the hell of it. Why do people climb mountains? Why did we go to the moon? Why do I jump down the stairs? Because we can.

Furthermore, when you are in the Linux world you should not think only in terms of desktops. Linux is often used for very small embedded systems. Those have tighter hardware requirements (although nowadays they are getting more loose). Also, you should not think of conventional desktops. Maybe a computer has 256 MB of RAM. Fine. But what if the user wants to run several virtual machines at once? They will want to minimize the memory needed by each virtual machine.

racepres · #93 Post by **racepres** » Wed 24 Mar 2010, 02:52

You mean like this
http://www.handlewithlinux.com/smallest-linux-pc

RP

jpeps · #94 Post by **jpeps** » Wed 24 Mar 2010, 05:16

Pizzasgood wrote:
Linux From Scratch, on the other hand, is a book. It's a guide. It shows you how to make your own Linux system from scratch. There is plenty of room to do things your way.

The end result is that you get a system that has exactly the things you want, and that you compiled yourself so that it can have exactly the compiler flags you want and be aimed at exactly the architecture you want.

It takes a lot of work. But for many people it is worth it for the reward.

Unless things have changed since I did it, not much was said about configuring the kernel...so most people ended up copying someone else's config..unless you really know what you're doing. Other than that, it was rather simple follow the dots, cut & paste. Making a unique distro is about all the coding, etc, that comes later. That takes a few additional skills.... good for learning basics, like how to compile, though....

DMcCunney · #95 Post by **DMcCunney** » Thu 25 Mar 2010, 01:42

Pizzasgood wrote: Furthermore, when you are in the Linux world you should not think only in terms of desktops. Linux is often used for very small embedded systems. Those have tighter hardware requirements (although nowadays they are getting more loose).

I have a Linksys WRT54G wireless router. V1 - V4 of it used an embedded Linux 2.4 kernel and Busybox, though you never saw that if you used the default firmware. But because it was Linux based, he firmware was open source, and a variety of third party forks were created to fix bugs and add features. I ran one called Tomato, and my SO was bemused that I could telnet into the router and run vi on it to edit scripts.

Lots of other embedded apps are Linux based. The Palm Pre's WebOS uses a Linux kernel customized for the purpose by embedded systems vendor Wind River Systems. Japan's Access Corp. offers the Access Linux Platform as an embedded OS aimed at Asian smartphone vendors, using a Linux implementation they got from acquiring China Mobile.

And Google's Android OS is Linux based.

A few years ago this would have been less possible, as current Linux implementations need a certain amount of hardware to run acceptably, but hardware is getting faster and cheaper, so as you comment, requirements are loosening.
______
Dennis

Woof Woof Brysche · #96 Post by **Woof Woof Brysche** » Tue 06 Apr 2010, 03:15

daftdog wrote:daftdog wrote:
R.I.P...free speech.
Woof Woof Brysche wrote:
Lol, now I need to go to the DSL forums to apologize!
No, it was not my intention for you to do this. I was trying to support you against others who think they can issue orders or they have some sort of moral high ground (people who themselves post offensive content on this forum). I don't necessarily agree with what you wrote but you have the right to express it.

Dear lord. It's the fact that I was expected by him to go to a forum that I'm not even a part of, even if it exists. Pretty sure it doesn't.

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(old)Puppy Linux Discussion Forum

Damn Small Linux complaint...