The Future of Puppy Linux

[jonyo]

I'm not following you. Would you care to elaborate (plain English please)?

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=innit

I wonder why he couldn't just have said "isn't it"? Thanks for the link jonyo.

from the link

Linguists and scientists have studied chav language and have determined the following:
1) they have tried to invent their own language
2) this is because they do no understand standard English
3) they use their "pikey-speak" to communicate with other like chavs
4) they speak in a pattern:
5) (noun), (obscene word), (verb), (subject), (innit)!
6) the pattern of speech repeats itself
7) the order may be altered according to IQ of the chav

maybe this

Contraction of "isn't it", "isn't he/she", "aren't they", "isn't there" and many other end-of-sentence questions. For greatest effect use in places where it would make no sense whatsoever if expanded.

[shariebeth]

*sighs*
And again.

Same problem presented, different people presenting. How many threads like this have there been over the years? And every time the people trying to make a difference get shot down by the same handful of "devs" with exactly the same defense.

Then the threads get moved back out of view by countless other pointless threads quickly surfacing designed to move the offending threads out of circulation.

I disagree with the "Do-ocracy" analogy. One person can't do it alone. Not when the few people with the ability and power to "let them in" stamp them with the "reject" stamp. Nobody can "do" without appropriate "official" support. You know, that unofficial inner circle that exists even though you claim it doesn't.

Devs vs users. Or as has been made painfully clear:
"Devs the hard workers" vs "users the leeches-USERS-beggars-whiners"

As has been pointed out so many times, devs do ask for feedback and want and need it. And yet when they get it, they don't like it and call us derogatory names (see above paragraph). And then when users and testers feel unappreciated and unlistened to (go READ the threads, this is NOT about not getting everything we want, but about even basic things not working and then projects get abandoned or worse, told "oh well, I don't care, I only do this for fun"), the devs complain they aren't getting enough feedback. Go figure.

There are so many puplets even the "devs" are confused. Information is scattered at best, help is scattered at best, and anyone who DARES be different or suggest change is run out of town with lame and obvious excuses and reasons.

You seriously can't claim it is the same "dissenters" always looking to make trouble in these forums or on IRC when in reality so many people feel the same way. They all may present differently - some more diplomatic than others - but in the end puppy really is a mess.

I think the devs sometimes get blinded by their own projects and even sometimes the stress and pressure of that, and can't see the forest for the trees. And nobody here would be hanging around STILL trying to fight for a fix if they didn't think puppy was worth it.

And yeah, I know this will be just another one of those threads. Nothing will change, and it will get shoved to the back quickly when it dies down.

There are some great devs here. There were some great puppies here. But being a great dev does not in ANY way excuse the rude behavior to users and testers. And if you aren't interested (as a dev) in what users think or want their input, keep your puplet and ego trip to yourself then.

One last comment and observation and I think a most important one.
In NO way does having suggestions, criticisms, requests, or even complaints mean that we are not grateful for the efforts put out by Barry, WhoDo, Iguleder, whoever made the wonderful 431 version, Jemimah, and a few others I know I should include but the names escape me this second. We are grateful. We wouldn't all be here fighting for something if we weren't. Get that through your heads, please, even if nothing else does.
Do not presume to follow this with the usual posts of "But you should be grateful, not wanting this or that!" "All hail wonderful Barry and I hope he doesn't see this thread|post ever! Ignore the ungrateful wretch!"

I loved my Puppy 431. I am sorry Puppy has come to this. Again.

[jpeps]

In a free market the best ideas come from individual inventors and entrepreneurs. Users have little or nothing to say about the product other than buying or not buying it.

Market=Users

[jonyo]

Devs vs users. Or as has been made painfully clear:
"Devs the hard workers" vs "users the leeches-USERS-beggars-whiners

my response is shove it

[James C]

Now is about the time for AJ to magically appear.

[jpeps]

*sighs*

One last comment and observation and I think a most important one.
In NO way does having suggestions, criticisms, requests, or even complaints mean that we are not grateful Get that through your heads, please, even if nothing else does.

ah..gee....thanx

[puppyite]

Q5sys,
I’ve never understood why some people such as yourself are so concerned with this business of Ad hominem. I see no difference between a man attacking me or attacking my ideas. I assume they know what they’re getting themselves into and are prepared for the consequences. In my world provocation equals justification.

[puppyite]

About Ductus exemplo: I’m not a candidate for the Puppy Linux Governing Council so this doesn’t apply to me.

[Q5sys]

I see no difference between a man attacking me or attacking my ideas.

Wait... what? Are you serious? So in otherwords all your comments against others ideas like Puppy 5.3 being based on Slackware.. the version number... etc. Those are all attacks by you against those individuals?
If an attack against an idea is an attack against the individual (which you just stated)... Then you admit that you are attacking everyone personally.
How is this the action of a mature adult? Guess your HOA must be a very hostile place.

Furthermore YOU are the man who claimed that logic and strategic thinking were your strong points. However you are unable to make a logical argument without relying on what are called 'Logical fallacies'. This is just another example of your error in thinking. You claim to be logical yet argue using falsehoods and fallacious reasoning.

In my world provocation equals justification.

How very un-democratic of you. Sounds like every other totalitarian form of government in its attemp to silence ideas it does not agree with.

At first when I read your posts I thought of the famous line 'a riddle wrapped in an enigma' but now I see its something else.
You are a contradiction wrapped within a contradiction.

[jonyo]

I know this forum is leaderless, which I think is good.

how so?

[puppyite]

Q5sys,
Attack my ideas and you attack me:

“I have only the power of my convictions to justify my existence.

[puppyluvr]

Hello,

Now is about the time for AJ to magically appear.

[jpeps]

I know this forum is leaderless, which I think is good.

how so?

Provides useful insights into the human condition.

[shariebeth]

I don’t pretend to speak other languages. I don’t recommend that others pretend to either.

Like XHTML ?

[Q5sys]

[quote="puppyite"]Q5sys,
Attack my ideas and you attack me:

“I have only the power of my convictions to justify my existence.

[jrb]

We're Not Here For A
Long Time (We're Here For A Good Time)

[jonyo]

hey q5 what is your fixation with puppyite????

he mumbles a few words and you end up babbling about it

[reckrhodes]

because puppyite and the likes does not care about our feelings here. sorry guys i am emotional here.

[RetroTechGuy]

The only thing "sacred" about Puppy's size is that it tied to its support for older hardware that doesn't have the RAM to allow loading a full CD into memory to run! The "number" was, and has always been, related to the capacity of the hardware to let Puppy to run in modest RAM. There is still a lot of usable hardware out there that has 512Mb or less, and that's Puppy's niche. You don't like the niche? Go invent your own Puppy; reprise Fat Dog if you must. Just stop insisting that official Puppy meet your expectations in some mythological war between the various OS.

What I'd like to see (or identify the appropriate version) is one that runs pretty well on 128MB. I booted one machine with 64MB, but it was painful -- marginally functional once up, and a swap file was installed (I actually had more RAM than that to install, but was testing how small for booting). The doesn't need to be the main version, but rather a nice stripped down Retro version (I should note that I haven't fully tested ttuuxxx's 2.14 Top 7 -- and haven't tried it on such a machine yet).

Historically, Win98 would run pretty well in 128 MB, if you weren't doing anything too fancy. For email and browsing it was pretty good.

Puppy is just a little more memory intensive, and for similar performance, I think it needs at least 256 MB, and probably more like 512 MB... A little lower memory requirements, and many more machines could be well supported...

[WhoDo]

What I'd like to see (or identify the appropriate version) is one that runs pretty well on 128MB. I booted one machine with 64MB, but it was painful -- marginally functional once up, and a swap file was installed (I actually had more RAM than that to install, but was testing how small for booting). The doesn't need to be the main version, but rather a nice stripped down Retro version (I should note that I haven't fully tested ttuuxxx's 2.14 Top 7 -- and haven't tried it on such a machine yet).

Historically, Win98 would run pretty well in 128 MB, if you weren't doing anything too fancy. For email and browsing it was pretty good.

Puppy is just a little more memory intensive, and for similar performance, I think it needs at least 256 MB, and probably more like 512 MB... A little lower memory requirements, and many more machines could be well supported...

The original reprise of 2.14 ... namely 2.14R by Dougal et al ... was such a beast. It may even have been the basis of ttuuxxx's 2.14xx reprise. Either way that and 2.17.1 should run nicely in 128Mb. That was the version I used to put on refurbushed P1 and PII machines for charity way back when. We almost never had 256Mb to play with and our average was 96Mb. You would always need a swap partition with 64Mb and below, even back to 2.01 IIRC.