Light-Debian-Core-Live-CD-Wheezy + Porteus-Wheezy

[saintless]

Hi, Terry.

Here`s gtkdialog-splash that I`ve modified ( Help type: gtkdialog-splash ).
It only had text input as an argument, I added -file and also stdin as text input methods.

I see in help output there is kill command. Debian does not have kill but killall or pkill instead.
But I see we already have /usr/bin/gtkdialog-splash from Frisbee deb package Fred made I guess. So which one gtkdialog-splash version we keep? Is this the one you modified from /usr//bin in DebianDog?

# Compiling brings up another needed utility: upx
It compresses an exec. file ( with gzip I think...). BIG size difference.!.

Isn't it this what we need?

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root@debian:~# apt-cache search  upx-
upx-ucl - efficient live-compressor for executables

root@debian:~# apt-get install upx-ucl
Reading package lists... Done
Building dependency tree       
Reading state information... Done
The following extra packages will be installed:
  libucl1
The following NEW packages will be installed:
  libucl1 upx-ucl
0 upgraded, 2 newly installed, 0 to remove and 25 not upgraded.
Need to get 519 kB of archives.
After this operation, 1772 kB of additional disk space will be used.
Do you want to continue [Y/n]?

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root@debian:~# upx-ucl
                       Ultimate Packer for eXecutables
                          Copyright (C) 1996 - 2011
UPX 3.08        Markus Oberhumer, Laszlo Molnar & John Reiser   Dec 12th 2011

Usage: upx-ucl [-123456789dlthVL] [-qvfk] [-o file] file..

Commands:
  -1     compress faster                   -9    compress better
  -d     decompress                        -l    list compressed file
  -t     test compressed file              -V    display version number
  -h     give more help                    -L    display software license
Options:
  -q     be quiet                          -v    be verbose
  -oFILE write output to 'FILE'
  -f     force compression of suspicious files
  -k     keep backup files
file..   executables to (de)compress

Type 'upx-ucl --help' for more detailed help.

UPX comes with ABSOLUTELY NO WARRANTY; for details visit http://upx.sf.net

Toni

[mcewanw]

Hi, Terry.

Here`s gtkdialog-splash that I`ve modified ( Help type: gtkdialog-splash ).
It only had text input as an argument, I added -file and also stdin as text input methods.

I see in help output there is kill command. Debian does not have kill but killall or pkill instead.
...
Toni

You are mistaken about the kill command (for killing a process by pid), Toni. I can't imagine a system without it:

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root@debian:~# which kill
/bin/kill
root@debian:~# ls -al /bin/kill
-rwxr-xr-x 1 root root 17968 Jan 26 13:54 /bin/kill

I believe there is a builtin bash version of kill too:

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bash version I think:

root@debian:~# kill
kill: usage: kill [-s sigspec | -n signum | -sigspec] pid | jobspec ... or kill -l [sigspec]

standalone version:

root@debian:~# /bin/kill

Usage:
 kill [options] <pid> [...]

Options:
 <pid> [...]            send signal to every <pid> listed
 -<signal>, -s, --signal <signal>
                        specify the <signal> to be sent
 -l, --list=[<signal>]  list all signal names, or convert one to a name
 -L, --table            list all signal names in a nice table

 -h, --help     display this help and exit
 -V, --version  output version information and exit

For more details see kill(1).
root@debian:~#

[saintless]

Hi, William.
Yes you are right.
Sorry, Terry. I got confused from output similar to kill not found while experimenting with gtkdialog-splash.

Toni

[mcewanw]

Since, as you say Toni, users are going to install their preferred browser, I think the iso should provide the smallest, least resource hungry, gui browser available. That appears to be dillo by a long shot. Certainly it doesn't do CSS very well at all, but it is fine (and fast) for man pages and initial downloads, which is all I feel that is required of it. Providing two small browsers (dillo and netsurf) seems to me like overkill.

EDIT: On second thoughts, dillo is just too ugly without good CSS support. I'd go for Netsurf as the prettiest of the bunch. I don't think ftp ability is important for these small browsers when the user is bound to install a larger browser of their own choice anyway. But ugly rendering is not good... Having said that, I'm really not sure! None are perfect...

Whilst adding small scripts is no problem, I also think you should be careful not to add too many MB here and there of what could be optional addons, Within reason, I feel it is better to keep Debian Dog as Light Core as you can. Porteus-Wheezy is different because it doesn't try to be as light as possible in the sense, for example, that it already comes with iceweasel by default.

[saintless]

Hi, William.

I do keep in mind the size of added programs and scripts. /opt/bin folder is 1,3 Mb uncompressed and I have some stuff to clean from there. Small GUI scripts as pure-ftp are very good alternative to the debian programs. Transmission from puppy is at least 10 times smaller than debian version. Yes, it is older version but not so old. It supports magnet links which is important. There is no doubt almost everyone will use torrent client and Transmission is well known for linux community.

We also have some reserved space for small scripts and programs which will be free for the last version. For example in the testing module we keep around 3,5 Mb to be cleaned in /var/log and 2,8 Mb in /usr/share/gnome + several much smaller files in $HOME/

About the WWW Browser I also would go with Netsurf but I'm not ready yet to exclude Dillo from the plan. Need some more time to test them. One is for sure - H3V will be replaced in the next testing module.

Toni

[nooby]

saintless looks promising that you and the others
are this motivated to make something that good.

Keep at it. Looking forward to something even me
can boot up and unsderstand.

The most important for me is that the OS should be good at
using Lan and Wan and what have you.

Some Puppies need good knowledge how to set up networks

which I does not have and most likely would fail to learn too
regardless of how motivated I would be.

My lack of patience and lack of memory for details of instructions.

[fredx181]

Hi Toni, All
When trying to get curlftpfs working as user puppy I found something wrong with fuse on DebianDog and Porteus-Wheezy. (seems like ownership problem)
Doing a google search I found lots of info about issues with curlftpfs and did all the things required to make it work.
Adding puppy to the fuse group, uncomment line "user_allow_other" in /etc/fuse.conf and other things.
No matter what I tried, always got this:

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fusermount: failed to open /etc/fuse.conf: Permission denied
fusermount: option allow_other only allowed if 'user_allow_other' is set in /etc/fuse.conf

But I had it set!
And also "-o allow_other" in curlftpfs command line.
So finally I reinstalled fuse and that did make it work suddenly.
ls output before and after reinstalling fuse:
Before:

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puppy@debian:~$ ls -l /bin/fusermount
-rwxr-xr-- 1 root root 30152 Jan 26 13:54 /bin/fusermount
puppy@debian:~$ ls -l /etc/fuse.conf
-rw-r----- 1 root root 215 Mar  9 17:19 /etc/fuse.conf

After:

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puppy@debian:~$ ls -l /bin/fusermount
-rwsr-xr-- 1 root fuse 30152 Jan  2  2013 /bin/fusermount
puppy@debian:~$ ls -l /etc/fuse.conf
-rw-r----- 1 root fuse 215 Mar  9 17:19 /etc/fuse.conf

Just for info last part of apt-get installing fuse:

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Unpacking replacement fuse ...
Processing triggers for initramfs-tools ...
I: update-initramfs is disabled (live system is running without media mounted on /lib/live/mount/medium).
Setting up fuse (2.9.0-2+deb7u1) ...
udev active, skipping device node creation.
I: update-initramfs is disabled (live system is running without media mounted on /lib/live/mount/medium).
Processing triggers for initramfs-tools ...
I: update-initramfs is disabled (live system is running without media mounted on /lib/live/mount/medium).

I'm not sure if this could be a problem.

Toni,

I can only applaud your next mission Smile
It will be very good to replace Gftp with smaller alternative

What is it that you like to do with it, mount ftp site and copy files to, to have it this way for uploading?
I have no idea yet what options there should be in the gui.

Regards
Fred

[sunburnt]

Fred; I`ve noticed that in general fuse can be "flakey". I`m not sure what you`re using it for.
I`ve used ftp gui`s before, most seem similar. Maybe a drag-n-drop desktop icon for upload.?
It could popup a menu like ArcDrop with history and managed lists, and a url text box.

Toni; Yes, that looks like the upx utility, Debian certainly loves to rename things doesn`t it.?
It small and could be part DebianDog, but it`s special use, so maybe we`ll make a "Devx" pkg.

I looked, but I didn`t see gtkdialog-splash in DebianDog. I think my version has markup trouble.
I`ll look to see if that`s so and fix it. Or maybe I`ll rename it so it`ll coexist with gtkdialog-splash.
.

[saintless]

After:

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puppy@debian:~$ ls -l /bin/fusermount
-rwsr-xr-- 1 root fuse 30152 Jan  2  2013 /bin/fusermount
puppy@debian:~$ ls -l /etc/fuse.conf
-rw-r----- 1 root fuse 215 Mar  9 17:19 /etc/fuse.conf

Thank you, Fred! Not sure about this but it is very possible to have something left with wrong ownership from the mixed permissions I made at the beginnig. If it works I will change fusermount ownership this way.

Edit: Here is the output from KDPup:

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-rwsr-xr-x 1 root root 20020 Jan 14  2010 /usr/bin/fusermount

Similar but not the same. I guess it is different in Debian?
Debian live standard does not have /bin/fusermount file at all so I can't check there. It has /bin/fuse which is rwxr instead rwsr

Edit 2: Testing shows just changing -rwsr-xr-- seems not to work. Maybe fuse need to be reinstalled. I test wuth typing fusermount from puppy account.
Changing fusermount to -rwsr-xr-x works out of the box, but I'm not sure it has to be this way for user account.

Just for info last part of apt-get installing fuse:

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Unpacking replacement fuse ...
Processing triggers for initramfs-tools ...
I: update-initramfs is disabled (live system is running without media mounted on /lib/live/mount/medium).
Setting up fuse (2.9.0-2+deb7u1) ...
udev active, skipping device node creation.
I: update-initramfs is disabled (live system is running without media mounted on /lib/live/mount/medium).
Processing triggers for initramfs-tools ...
I: update-initramfs is disabled (live system is running without media mounted on /lib/live/mount/medium).

I'm not sure if this could be a problem.

This is the price we pay for not using original initrd.img made with live-boot v.3.x
It is not a problem but makes updating initramfs a little bit complicated.
First simple way is to use the original initrd.img, but I do not like this.
Second simple way is to create mount point /lib/live/mount/medium and small save file 5Mb for example in /live/image/test-save
Then use:

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mount -o loop /live/image/test-save /lib/live/mount/medium

Of course we also need to put back initrd.img and vmlinuz in /boot (just use the module with boot folder from the site).
Then you can update initramfs without errors.

What is it that you like to do with it, mount ftp site and copy files to, to have it this way for uploading?
I have no idea yet what options there should be in the gui.

I need only to upload files and delete files from smokey01 site.
Fred, if it gets complicate do not waste time on this. Gftp is not very big - around 4,5 Mb uncompressed. DebianDog can live without ftp-client if it is complicate to make GUI.

Toni

[saintless]

Debian certainly loves to rename things doesn`t it.?
It small and could be part DebianDog, but it`s special use, so maybe we`ll make a "Devx" pkg.

Hi, Terry. Yes But you can't deny it has almost all we need available for download from debian repoes
I prefer to keep it in DEVX module. Already started to make one with linux-headers, build-essentials and checkinstall. It will be around 55-60Mb I think. But I have much work to do separating the devx packages in /var/lib/dpkg/status file and preparing the update dpkg database script.

I looked, but I didn`t see gtkdialog-splash in DebianDog. I think my version has markup trouble.

It is /usr/bin/gtkdialog-splash Wrtten from Barry K. Not sure when it got there but we have it almost from the beginning. I guess with some of Fred's packages.

Toni

[saintless]

The most important for me is that the OS should be good at
using Lan and Wan and what have you.

Hi, Nooby.
We use frisbee and I'm not sure it will auto-connect WiFi but you will have auto-working wired Lan with sure.
For auto-working on boot WiFi I can make you separate WICD module to be loaded in /live on boot.

Toni

[saintless]

I can only applaud your next mission Smile
It will be very good to replace Gftp with smaller alternative

What is it that you like to do with it, mount ftp site and copy files to, to have it this way for uploading?
I have no idea yet what options there should be in the gui.

My mistake, Fred. I think it will not work for smokey01.com It is http and not ftp site.
So it is up to you to make GUI as you wish. I will use it as you make it fit best for you.

Toni

[fredx181]

Hi Toni

Edit: Here is the output from KDPup:
Code:
-rwsr-xr-x 1 root root 20020 Jan 14 2010 /usr/bin/fusermount

Similar but not the same. I guess it is different in Debian?
Debian live standard does not have /bin/fusermount file at all so I can't check there. It has /bin/fuse which is rwxr instead rwsr

Edit 2: Testing shows just changing -rwsr-xr-- seems not to work. Maybe fuse need to be reinstalled. I test wuth typing fusermount from puppy account.
Changing fusermount to -rwsr-xr-x works out of the box, but I'm not sure it has to be this way for user account.

I think it's more simple and better to just reinstall fuse.
I understand what you wrote about update initrd.
To be honest I don't know anything of what the consequences might be when not updating.

My mistake, Fred. I think it will not work for smokey01.com It is http and not ftp site.

Yes, I was looking already if I missed something.

Anyway I liked the idea from Terry for drag 'n drop so maybe this can be useful (see attached remove dummy .tar)
It's for curlftpfs but maybe the concept can be useful for other things to drag n' drop by a little modifying.

Fred

[saintless]

To be honest I don't know anything of what the consequences might be when not updating.

Hi, Fred. I think it will not be a problem in this case because initramfs is already updated with the same fuse version. I will not purge fuse first. I will download fuse package and install it on top.

Anyway I liked the idea from Terry for drag 'n drop so maybe this can be useful (see attached remove dummy .tar)
It's for curlftpfs but maybe the concept can be useful for other things to drag n' drop by a little modifying.

Thank you, I will keep it in /opt/bin and test it proper tomorrow.

Toni

[sunburnt]

It looks like from what you guys are saying that Debian-Live uses fuse for it`s union.?
Hard to believe, most distros use aufs as it`s kernel land, fuse is user land of course.
I see fusermount, but no fuse, unionfs-fuse, or aufs. What`s Debian-Live using.?


Fred; I looked at gen_pup_xdg-system.jwmrc, and I see nothing really wrong with it.
# It and the menu file made by mk-menus are amazingly similar.
One thing is that the xprop app line is multi. line, but this shouldn`t be a problem.
# Did you notice that some icons have a path and the rest don`t.?
If the icons without paths are the ones not showing, edit add in a few paths and try it.
If those icons start showing, then tell me and I can look at fixing the Bacon exec.
But that part of the menu may not be generated by the Bacon exec., I don`t know...

JWM`s <IconPath> doesn`t work for me. But Puppy`s menu icons show fine with no paths.

# There seems to be important differences between Debian`s and Puppy`s jwm exec. files.

In looking at the menu you posted for mk-menus, I see you must have run "update-menus".
It explains the extra System category. mk-menus does not put <!-- #DEBIAN --> in the menu.
mk-menus works by itself, it uses no other menu utilities. Just make JWM menu file & refresh.


Your dndftp looks like it downloads with a dropped file link.?
Are you planning on expanding it with a popup menu to do up & downloading.?
.

[saintless]

Hi, Terry.

no fuse, unionfs-fuse, or aufs. What`s Debian-Live using.?

AFAIK Debian live's using aufs. It has new method of populating /etc/fstab file on boot using the information from this file /etc/fstab.d/live
The content inside live file is:

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aufs / aufs rw 0 0
tmpfs /tmp tmpfs nosuid,nodev 0 0

Any line you put there will appear in /etc/fstab on boot.
Debian Wheeze Live keeps clean /etc/fstab populated by /etc/fstab.d/live

JWM`s <IconPath> doesn`t work for me. But Puppy`s menu icons show fine with no paths.

# There seems to be important differences between Debian`s and Puppy`s jwm exec. files.

Yes, I also think there is a difference.For example I can not get top categories icons in JWM latest and older version to be generated by /etc/menu-methods/jwm in /etc/jwm/debian-menu I guess some function is missing and has to be added in /etc/menu-methods/jwm but can't find it for now.
It has nothing to do with the icons generated by mk-menus.
I just try to understand debian way of generating category icons.

BTW, Terry, are you using Jwm 2.2.1 from the deb package uploaded on the site? I see no new problems with the latest version and think to include it in next module.

Toni

[sunburnt]

Found aufs:
/mnt/sq/lib/modules/3.2.0-4-486/kernel/fs/aufs
/mnt/sq/lib/modules/3.2.0-4-686-pae/kernel/fs/aufs

Toni; I can`t seem to find the jwm file at Smoky`s. There isn`t a DebianDog section that I can see.
# Maybe I need to become a member.? I`ve always found what I`m looking for before...
.

[saintless]

Hi, Terry.

There is no DebianDog section yet. It is still Light-Wheezy.
All testing packages are mixed in Fredx181 folder.
Here is latest Jwm:
http://www.smokey01.com/saintless/Fredx ... 1_i386.deb
Install on top of older Jwm and exit x and start x again.

Toni

[mcewanw]

My time display is wrong. Do we have a way of setting that up and/or syncing it?

[saintless]

Hi, William.

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date --set 22:00:00
date --set 2014-03-10

Sets clock to H:M:S and date to 10 March 2014

Toni