hv3 alpha 14 (lightweight web browser)

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danielk1977 · #1 Post by **danielk1977** » Sun 12 Nov 2006, 14:48

Update again: Version 14:

http://tkhtml.tcl.tk/hv3-alpha-14.tgz

Update: Version 13:

http://tkhtml.tcl.tk/hv3-alpha-13.tgz

Hi,

There is a package of the hv3 web browser version "alpha 12" available at the following URI:

http://tkhtml.tcl.tk/hv3-alpha-12.tgz (509537 bytes)

UPDATE: The following build fixes some problems with this and the other puppy linux forum that people have pointed out:

http://tkhtml.tcl.tk/hv3-alpha-12b.tgz (509712 bytes)

Hv3 is a web browser based on Tcl/Tk, released under the BSD license. It doesn't support javascript or plugins, but has pretty reasonable support for HTML forms, cookies, HTTPS and CSS2. After installing, run it with a command like:

$ hv3 -statefile ~/hv3.db

The -statefile option tells hv3 where to store it's cookies and visited URIs databases. If you don't specify one things will still work, but all your cookies and stuff will be stored in memory only. Multiple instances of hv3 can (and should) access the same statefile simultaneously, as it is an sqlite database (http://www.sqlite.org).

The install footprint of this one is rather large - a shade under 1300K. There are some tricks we can do to reduce that in the long run (eg. don't use shared libraries, deploy the tcl scripts in a zip file). That hasn't happened yet, as the current development focus is improving the accuracy and speed of the rendering engine. We'll get there...

Any and all feedback is most welcome, both on the software itself and it's suitability for use with puppy linux (is it too large, too slow, use too much memory, get too many web pages wrong, segfault as soon as you start it etc.). Bugs can be reported here, by email to me or using the bug report form at the following URI:

http://tkhtml.tcl.tk/cvstrac/tktnew

Remember, it's open-source so it's a moral imperitive to report bugs

. Feature requests and suggestions would also be helpful.

Dan.

raffy · #2 Post by **raffy** » Tue 14 Nov 2006, 01:35

Thanks, Daniel, will do as you suggested, if not in that forum then here below.

It works well in 2.12beta2 !!!

Suggestion: Including in your post the filesize so users will know immediately how small a file they are getting.

Report: I cannot edit this post in hv3. Only one line is included in the textbox.

In Azbb Forum http://puppyos.net/forum , I can't stay connected (meaning, that am being logged out when I click on new links within the forum).

BarryK · #3 Post by **BarryK** » Tue 14 Nov 2006, 12:12

Note, you won't actually save any space in Puppy by zipping, if we build hv3 into the pup_xxx.sfs file ...which may eventually happen, as hv3 is getting so good!

Nathan F · #4 Post by **Nathan F** » Tue 14 Nov 2006, 16:28

It's getting very good at rendering to be sure, but still uses a lot of cpu time on my machine. Too much for me to use it much.

Nathan

#5 Post by **Pizzasgood** » Tue 14 Nov 2006, 19:27

In Azbb Forum http://puppyos.net/forum , I can't stay connected (meaning, that am being logged out when I click on new links within the forum).

I haven't tried it yet, but just by guessing I'd suggest checking the cookie settings.

raffy · #6 Post by **raffy** » Tue 14 Nov 2006, 23:19

@Pizzasgood:
Oh, I haven't looked there, as it was doing OK with this Forum (not logging me out). It must be the way cookies are handled in that site (or by hv3) that makes the difference.

@Nathan
Yes, it uses a large amount of CPU load. This may be one are where Barry and the crew can help.

danielk1977 · #7 Post by **danielk1977** » Wed 15 Nov 2006, 05:21

I'm reliably informed editing of posts doesn't work using hv3.

It seems the [nodeHandle text -pre] command is busted....

Hooray! It was easy to fix (my favourite kind of bug).

http://tkhtml.tcl.tk/cvstrac/chngview?cn=806

danielk1977 · #8 Post by **danielk1977** » Wed 15 Nov 2006, 11:22

Hi again,

I updated the first post in this thread with a link to a build that fixes the problems hv3 has with this and the other puppy linux forum. Bug reports much appreciated. Thanks!

Re the CPU usage problem - your concerns are noted. I'm not happy about the amount it uses either. I had a quick look with gprof and there are a few bits of code that are a bit silly that would be easy to fix, but nothing that will produce a dramatic improvement. I want to put this thing on mobile devices (i.e. pocket pc etc.) some time, so I'll be working on it. I'll let people know when I think it is worth testing out again in this respect.

So thanks again for the reports! More of the same would be much appreciated.

Dan.

PS: It goes without saying that anyone who is interested in helping out with code/website/whatever would be most welcome

kdulcimer · #9 Post by **kdulcimer** » Sat 18 Nov 2006, 17:41

Thanks for all you've done with hv3!

Puppy Linux is not my main OS (PCLinuxOS is), but I greatly admire all the work done in official Puppy and on the Puppy forums. With PCLinuxOS, we've started a project forum, where I am an administrator. My project is the creation of TinyMe, which is basically trying to make PCLOS acquire some of Puppy's good features like speed and especially size. I started out hoping we could get the ISO size down to 100MB but it looks like that won't happen, at least not yet. We're seriously looking at using hv3 for our browser. If you want to take a look at our efforts, the address is:

http://www.mypclinuxos.com/index.php?op ... board=38.0

danielk1977 · #10 Post by **danielk1977** » Tue 21 Nov 2006, 13:50

Thanks for the kind words kdulcimer. The tinyme project looks good so far.

I had to tweak hv3 a little to log in to your forum (because Refresh headers weren't
implemented), but after that I still couldn't post a reply in the browser thread because
I am too thick to figure out where the "post" button is! (help!). I don't think this is
an hv3 problem because I couldn't find it in firefox either. Maybe because my user
account is brand new? Or because I am javascript-disadvantaged?

Anyhow if you send me a link describing how to do so I'll build a package for tinyme
along with the next hv3 release. At this stage I will try anything that might get some
more bug reports - particularly surrounding cookies, http headers etc., which are
a real weak point.

Dan.

klhrevolutionist · #11 Post by **klhrevolutionist** » Fri 24 Nov 2006, 21:30

Another release of HV3 is out ! You can download the puppy unleashed package that is available here, http://tkhtml.tcl.tk/hv3.html
FYI, I am posting this from the new release. Great work !

BarryK · #12 Post by **BarryK** » Sat 25 Nov 2006, 01:30

I notice the webpage describes it as a "dotpup", whereas it is actually a "PupGet" package.

BarryK · #13 Post by **BarryK** » Sat 25 Nov 2006, 02:03

Test post, using HV3 alpha13.
I already tested on my developer blog, rendered and posted perfectly.

BarryK · #14 Post by **BarryK** » Sat 25 Nov 2006, 02:11

There were reports of excessive cpu usage with earlier versions? I see no problem running HV3 right now. Top shows modest usage.

Congrats guys, this project is looking so good!

Now, bolt on a Javascript interpreter....

...because I just clicked on an emoticon icon and got an error message -- because that's done with Javascript.
The reality these days is you have to support Javascript. All other stuff, like Java,
Flash, all optional.

This is great. This could be the killer app for Tcl/Tk. For tiny distros, if HV3 gets good enough for general browsing, then other tiny distros will put in Tcl/Tk so that they can run HV3, and having done that they will realise there's lots of other great Tcl/Tk apps out there, so the floodgates are opened!

muggins · #15 Post by **muggins** » Sat 25 Nov 2006, 07:12

barry,

i've experienced same ram gobbling as nathan. when you say it works OK for you, how much ram do you have. (i've got 64Mbytes)

raffy · #16 Post by **raffy** » Sat 25 Nov 2006, 07:54

"top" command in console showed high cpu usage in my Celeron 400, but that was the first posted version. Many improvements have been done since.

This is great - and the release uses the pupget format - thanks!

muggins · #17 Post by **muggins** » Sat 25 Nov 2006, 08:15

raffy,

can you give any indication of cpu load of current hv3, compared with dillo? (which i think is main contender for a light browser in puppy). i've only got 64M ram & firefox gradually eats all of it up, necessitating control-backspace, after a couple of hours. i've tried hv3 twice now, and there's no gradual eating of ram...straight away it's using 90%+ of my ram, stopping me doing/using any other utility.

what i don't undrstand, (perhaps daniel can explain this), is that barry's phv, which i thought had the same origins as hv3, is tiny & has quite minimal load on system. (it probly has a lot less functionality than hv3....?)

BarryK · #18 Post by **BarryK** » Sat 25 Nov 2006, 09:54

My old 'hv' uses a much older tcl-html library and is only suitable for use as an internal html reader, not for general web browsing.

The PC I'm using right now has 256MB RAM. Perhaps hv3 gets stressed with only 64MB? ...do you have a swap partition?

muggins · #19 Post by **muggins** » Sat 25 Nov 2006, 10:03

yes, i've got 200M+ swap. i wonder about nathan's configuration?.

muggins · #20 Post by **muggins** » Sat 25 Nov 2006, 10:07

i'll download the newest version tomorrow & give it another spin & report back any +'ves/-'ves.

(old)Puppy Linux Discussion Forum

(old)Puppy Linux Discussion Forum

hv3 alpha 14 (lightweight web browser)

hv3 alpha 14 (lightweight web browser)

Will do - thanks

CPU

a sample post to test post editing in hv3.

Fixes for forum websites

pclinuxos

HV3 Browser

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