A Christian version of Puppy?

Message

LOF · #21 Post by **LOF** » Tue 23 Jan 2007, 21:15

Flash wrote:I wasn't aware that anyone to change his beliefs coming to Puppy.

There are some more fundamentalist religious people that may have a problem with certain select parts of Puppy. I'm not one of them but would like to think these people were included. But I do get your point.

If religion is so personal, why do so many people make a point of bringing up their religion in the forum? One of the most striking things about the bible is its complete lack of humor. I would also say the same about most of the religious people I've known, at least when it came to their religion. The reason it's called faith is that you choose to believe without any proof. You have to expect some ribbing.

Agreed, my religion has been starved of humour. I would like to think that this is more to do with being persecuted in past rather than just being boring. I like to think of myself as a more light-hearted christian. As to bringing it up a lot, religion becomes a major part of your life. You have to accept it and embrace it within your life. Thus it gets brought up a lot.
Oh and on the subject of ribbing. I get enough of that in my "real" life!

Thanks again everyone for your opinions. I think I'll give it a try and get back to you all!

Lobster · #22 Post by **Lobster** » Tue 23 Jan 2007, 22:07

my guru (missing - presumed eaten)
http://tmxxine.com/y/wikka.php?wakka=StolenGuru
always said "It is not the participation that counts - unless you win"
http://pages.britishlibrary.net/lobster/so/events.htm

We ate him with a side seaweed salad.

#23 Post by **Pizzasgood** » Tue 23 Jan 2007, 23:52

The way I see it, we have free will for one reason: God was bored. Building drones that worship you is not satisfying. Making people who freely choose too is. But it goes beyond having people worship you. I believe God wants us to make him laugh. Not just him, but us as well. He wants the universe to laugh with, or even at him.

But that's just my 329 bytes.

Marcel · #24 Post by **Marcel** » Wed 24 Jan 2007, 00:58

Sorry if anyone or any religion felt insulted.

That was not my intention. I really couldn't see (and still can't) the point of Puppies that were aimed at a section of the community chosen for their beliefs rather than for computing needs.

To me that means that Grafpup makes sense, Creatorpup doesn't.

However, if someone wants to do it - fine, it's a more or less free country in some parts of the world!

can8v · #25 Post by **can8v** » Fri 09 Feb 2007, 16:16

MU wrote:no, I get 33 hits.
wait, those might interest you:

http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic. ... 135&t=9721
http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic. ... 135&t=7976
http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic. ... 135&t=1168

hmm, you're right, not so many

Mark

I personally have contributed much on this and have posted instructions for getting e-sword working in Wine with puppy versions 2.01 and 2.02. I have considered making a Puplet called Holy Pup, but with my other evangelism efforts and my Web ministry at webwitness.net I just haven't found the time to finish the unleashed project. For now I am happy with Pizza Pup 3 with Wine, e-Sword, GIMP, and Java added on.

disciple · #26 Post by **disciple** » Fri 09 Feb 2007, 23:31

People's beliefs affect their computing needs - that is why some of the other Christian distros exist - some people strongly believe their children shouldn't be exposed to something called a "daemon" that is actually good, not evil, and a lot of people believe they shouldn't be using software of dubious legality, so they strip it out of the distro. Personally I think there would be a market for a puplet with e-sword working out of the box, but there may not be enough demand to make it worth keeping it updated. If you made one, you'd want to have a good selection of bibles installed (esv), and it may be worth looking at converting the macros for MS word to openoffice macros.

Lobster · #27 Post by **Lobster** » Sat 10 Feb 2007, 02:39

Disciple you make some good points. If you make any Bibles part of a dotpup or PET, then it will work in all versions of Puppy including future ones.

Otherwise you will create an ISO and unless you maintain it, people will be stuck at that version. However the original impetus was thought of very much as a way in for the Christian community.

#28 Post by **Flash** » Sat 10 Feb 2007, 03:11

There used to be a north-south highway called route 666 in eastern Arizona, until some religious people got the government to change the name.

can8v · #29 Post by **can8v** » Sat 10 Feb 2007, 05:49

Actually Lobster and Disciple,
The great thing about e-Sword was that it was unecessary to make dot pups for the add-on Bibles, because after I figure out the dll files that were not compatible in Wine and replaced them with the ones that come with e-Sword the bibles installed out of the box. I used some dot pup that MU put up that made it possible to double click exe files to execute them and that is all it took to install the add-on Bibles. At one point I had almost all of them installed, but I only use a few so I got rid of the rest. It is a fantastic setup you can search out the details by searching e-sword and can8v in the member line or you can scroll through the famous tkBible thread and find a link to it towards the end that will give you the progression. The soonest I will have time to take another shot at it will be Spring break.
Until the nets are full,
CAn8v

muggins · #30 Post by **muggins** » Sat 10 Feb 2007, 06:05

disciple mentioned that:

some people strongly believe their children shouldn't be exposed to something called a "daemon"

i wonder how strictly they apply these beliefs? would they modify their calendars to eliminate January, Easter, Saturdays, Fridays & Thursdays, as these are all named after pagan gods & goddesses? would their adherence to the sixth commandment preclude their using kill to terminate a running process?

i'll refrain from asking about the programming language, evil. but what about linux itself? in reverse it sounds positively diiabolical!

amish · #31 Post by **amish** » Sat 10 Feb 2007, 06:46

"daemon"...

well, the word "daemon" refers in greek iirc to an essence or quasi-deity that is actually about as good or bad as a human is good or bad. is it a problem acknowledging that some humans are good? you refer to them as "angels" some angels are bad... when an angel is bad, you call it a "demon" not a "daemon." i mean if literacy doesn't matter, then treat the words all the same. a "daemon" isn't a demon (although a demon is a daemon.) it's an angel. so was lucifer before the fall.

of course, no one is worshiping the daemons in linux (unless they worship linux too, but that's your decision.)

what to do? stop talking about planets named venus and mars? if there is a problem using a "daemon" there is just as much problem talking about 8 (or 9) planets by name. should we stop counting 666 when we count to 1000, too? when we get it as the answer to a math problem, should we round the answer?

"and a lot of people believe they shouldn't be using software of dubious legality"

please understand that microsoft violates software patents they don't hold as much as anyone else does, and they have been found to be an organization that is violating the law through their practices in the u.k. and the u.s. repeat: MICROSOFT software is of dubious legality, i would say far more than anything linux is. they said jesus was of dubious legality, it doesn't mean it's true.

if you are going to judge others, you have a responsibility (to others, to god, and especially to yourself, as you will be judged too) to do so fairly. joining others in false accusations isn't helpful.

furthermore you cannot judge fairly when you go about deliberately misinforming yourself, which is the equivilent of obsessing over words and ignoring the ideas behind the words. for the love of god, please consider it before we have more religion that throws out everything but the superficial. of course, i do not aim this at all christians (or all muslims) there are *plenty* of both that still live inside their religion, not outside, looking at just words. the problem is superficiality, not religion. words are containers for thought and meaning, if you throw thought and meaning away, you have empty words and empty religion.

and i still think a religious puppy is a fine idea / unneeded / okay / go ahead / whatever floats your boat / could be good just the same. but i seldom think it's good to be deliberately stupid.

"the letter of the law killeth" - mother theresa

disciple · #32 Post by **disciple** » Sat 10 Feb 2007, 12:11

Well in this case I wasn't actually judging anybody - just explaining how the beliefs of some people affect their computing needs. If I held to those particular beliefs I wouldn't be using Puppy - I'd be using the distro I saw somewhere that does (sorry - can't remember what it was exactly). And they are being consistent - they're not using Windows, they've stripped specific things that people claim infringe patents out, and they have (or maybe they are still working on it) modified absolutely everything to get rid of terms with connotations they don't like - daemon was just the only one I could remember. Perhaps they are using different names for months and the days of the week - some people do! Maybe they do just assume that children are illiterate - or they're more concered about the modern use of the word in fantasy literature/games.

#33 Post by **Pizzasgood** » Sun 11 Feb 2007, 01:51

I connotate "daemon" with the annoying pink virus-chick from some of the last episodes of Reboot. Her voice was annoying, but I don't think I'd rename them over it.

I've also heard about people who don't like the term "motherboard", the male-female ends of plugs, and master/slave drives. I wouldn't be surprised if someone took offense to 'FAT32", "cookies", or "wizards" either.

(Aside: my sister said the Cookie Monster sings about veggies now. What is our world coming to?

Sugar is a part of the food pyramid too (or at least it was, dunno if it still is). I refuse to let the world become the one shown in The Giver. C is for cookie, and that's good enough for me.)

Disclaimer: Still have no problem with a Christian Puppy, and it would be more than a vocab change. I just will never understand people who obsess over words. A blacklist is not racist, for crying out loud!

[/end display of frustration with society]

disciple · #34 Post by **disciple** » Sun 11 Feb 2007, 06:04

I hope it wouldn't be a vocab change as I really don't believe there is an issue there, and I think there would be virtually no market for it - what is the point in a system where all the commands and everything are different, just for the sake of it? - no compatibility, and everyone just has to relearn everything. I think it would be good to either have a Puppy with a good selection of useful Christian programs, or just have the programs packaged and easy to install.

can8v · #35 Post by **can8v** » Mon 12 Feb 2007, 01:34

disciple wrote:I think it would be good to either have a Puppy with a good selection of useful Christian programs, or just have the programs packaged and easy to install.

This is what I was aiming for with Holy Pup. The problem is that the license on the most critical application precludes packaging it with puppy. It is a Windoze app called e-Sword. Wonderful FREE application, but the license forbids packaging even with other freeware to make a complete product. Also forbidden is making a dot pup as the license does not allow distribution from a server other than the e-Sword server (presumably to give people a chance to donate). What I came up with was the idea to create a puplet that has Wine installed and configured for the installation so all the end user would have to do is download and double click the exe file from the e-Sword Web site, then do the same for whatever Bible modules the user selects. That was about the simplest solution I could come up with. There are other apps that could be packaged into a puplet to work out of the box, but they simply don't compare to e-Sword.

#36 Post by **Pizzasgood** » Mon 12 Feb 2007, 02:08

You could make an installer for it. You click it, then it downloads the file and installs it. That's what many dotpups do (off the top of my head, I've seen some Mplayer, Opera, Java, and 3DCC dotpups work that way).

can8v · #37 Post by **can8v** » Mon 12 Feb 2007, 04:10

Pizzasgood wrote:You could make an installer for it. You click it, then it downloads the file and installs it. That's what many dotpups do (off the top of my head, I've seen some Mplayer, Opera, Java, and 3DCC dotpups work that way).

That is a good point. If I was savvy enough to do that I would, but I was very lucky to even get the application working in Wine in the first place. I a have never made a dot pup and apparently we are already going to dot pet whatever that is.

Then there is the other issue: the e-Sword application doesn't work in Wine with Puppy versions 2.12 or 2.13. I have yet to figure out why. I can get it to work with versions 2.0 through 2.11, just not 2.12 or newer. I would spend some time figuring this out, but then we will have 2.14 pretty soon and that may solve the problem without my doing anything. Then again since I am fairly committed to using Pizza Pup 3 now and since it is based on Puppy 2.12 maybe I should figure the issues out and make another post here on the forum with the updated information then I could use it in Pizza Pup and anyone willing to take on the project of a Christian Puppy (whatever that would look like) could benefit from my past efforts as well. Perhaps I will, if time permits, get it done sometime before spring break. Or maybe someone more savvy than I will read my other threads on the topic with my instructions and pick up where I left off. With some clues from Rick Meyers the creator of the application and a blessing from God I managed to figure out the problems with the dll files in Wine and come up with a simple solution to the problem, but problems like that have been ordinarily out of my league. Unfortunately Rick has not expressed any interest whatever in Linux, much less porting the application to Linux, so for now Wine is the best hope.

Is there any interest in this right now? If there is sufficient interest I will pick this project up again or perhaps someone else is interested in picking up where I left off.

CAn8v

#38 Post by **Pizzasgood** » Mon 12 Feb 2007, 04:29

The method isn't restricted to dotpups. The dotpup is just a handy way to make something click-and-run that's also easy to download. For an actual puplet, a better way would be to have the script either in a rox-app or in /usr/sbin with a desktop icon or menu entry. Assuming Wine is already installed and configured, it would just need something like this:

Code: Select all

cd <wherever you want it>
wget -c <url-goes-here>

If it's in a zip file, you'd need to add an 'unzip' command, like so:

Code: Select all

cd <wherever you want it>
wget -c <url-goes-here> 
unzip <filename>

If that's all you need to do, it's done. Otherwise you could add a command to run, say, setup.exe:

Code: Select all

wine setup.exe

You'd put all that in a script, make sure it's exectutable (right-click, properties, check some boxes), and either put or link it somewhere the user can click it. You could also use Xdialog to display a "please wait" or "finished" message.

Code: Select all

Xdialog --msgbox "Finished installing.  Have fun." 0 0

can8v · #39 Post by **can8v** » Mon 12 Feb 2007, 05:21

Great little tutorial thanks. I had no idea it would be that simple. hmmm. . . Now I only need to figure out why my old setup for this application doesn't work with the latest Wine and/or Puppy 2.12 and newer.

cb88 · #40 Post by **cb88** » Tue 13 Feb 2007, 14:26

e-sword http://crosswire.org/sword/software/index.jsp
might require kde or gnome the other option is to use wine.

The most important thing is that you believe the whole Bible and not take things out of context.

No man is perfect therefore everyone needs saving. Jesus died to cover our imperfections with his infinite perfection(perfection is infinite) and make us sons of God. All that is required is that you know that you need salvation and you humbly ask for it. when I say KNOW I don't mean in your head I mean you really KNOW deep down then you can be saved.\

I must be off to my english class -writing in the academic community

cb88 -Baptist in the bible belt of the US North Carolina

(old)Puppy Linux Discussion Forum

(old)Puppy Linux Discussion Forum

A Christian version of Puppy?

Holy Puppy!

e-Sword

I think that some pupgets will do.