Puli 32/64 bit

[gjuhasz]

Let me proudly announce the new Puli 6.0.4

Available at http://smokey01.com/gjuhasz

See details in the first post.

What's new in Puli 6.0.4 compared to 6.0.3:

* Install package in .zip format
* Simplified "one-finger-one-minute" installation
* Auto-restore a couple of backups (a selected backup and the latest one) on top of each other
* Restore backups created in any security profile
* Forced security profiles available as pet packages
* Involve some internal apps to SmartSave (e.g., HomeBank)
* Multiple firewalls prepared
* Firewall menu rewritten
* The color of Firewall icon shows the selected firewall
* Both session-level and long term configuration in Session Setup dialog (aka QuickSetup).
* Help restructured
* Minor bugs fixed

Have fun!

Regards,

gjuhasz

[gjuhasz]

Since the settings are already recorded and applied, the "Also in future sessions" box could be unticked [and the existing backup replaced by a new backup], and the desired settings would still be applied.

I don't really understand your preference. I would appreciate if you could choose from the feasible solutions below. None of them is (intentionally) implemented yet.

A. The settings in the actual puli.cfg should always be applied even if a backup with different settings is restored.

Options for this case
a) exclude the session settings from backups at all.
b) include them in backup but exclude at restore_latest and restore_fixed
c) as in b) but also exclude at manual restore
d) as in b) or c) but they appear somewhere in /temp folder
e) as in d) but they are displayed if you open the SessionSetup dialog and become active if you click OK there

B. The settings that come from backups should always overwrite the settings that come from puli.cfg?

C. As in B but the settings are overwritten only if enabled in puli.cfg by "nextsession=yes"

D. As in B but the settings are overwritten only if enabled in puli.cfg by a new control, e.g., "restorable=yes"


Please advise.

Regardless of the above, I changed the behavior of the "Also in future sessions" checkbox in the Session Setup dialog. This is not a bugfix, but a different flavor
Uploaded to http://www.smokey01.com/gjuhasz/Puli-6. ... h-optional folder.

You can download its content to /mnt/sdbx/patch.

Have fun!

Regards,

gjuhasz

[Sylvander]

1. "I changed the behavior of the "Also in future sessions" checkbox in the Session Setup dialog. This is not a bugfix, but a different flavor
Uploaded to www.smokey01.com/gjuhasz/Puli-6.0.4_Oct2015/patch-optional folder.
You can download its content to /mnt/sdbx/patch."
a. There are 2 sub-directories inside that directory; am I to download both of them plus their content to my Puli's /mnt/sdbx/patch folder?
I doubt it.
I think I misunderstand what you say.

2. "The settings in the actual puli.cfg should always be applied even if a backup with different settings is restored."
a. OUCH! Looks like yet again I failt to understand how Puli works "under the hood".
b. Is that because puli.cfg over-rides the settings copied from "Session Setup" to some other config file?
OR...
c. Does the backup exclude such settings?
d. Is your "Options for this case" intended to explain in more detail?
I'm attempting [and so far failing] to understand these.

3. "Please advise."
Are you asking me to state which of options a,b,c,d,e,B,C,D I prefer?
I'd be delighted to if only I understood them.
I do begin to understand, for example:
"B. The settings that come from backups should always overwrite the settings that come from puli.cfg?"..
And I'm inclined to think that this option seems a good idea, but "a little knowledge is a dangerous thing", and so methinks it needs someone like you who has greater understanding [of Puli and how it works] to make such decisions.

[gjuhasz]

There are 2 sub-directories inside that directory; am I to download both of them plus their content to my Puli's /mnt/sdbx/patch folder?

I decided to support Puli by populating a couple of patch folders next to the install package at http://www.smokey01.com/gjuhasz/Puli-6.0.4_Oct2015. One is patch-bugfix, another one is patch-optional. Both of them may contain a patch structure. I propose to merge their content with the actual content of your patch folder on the USB boot device. As of today, the (populated) sub-folders within patch-optional are smartsave and usr (the latter has the sbin subfolder with a modified quicksetup file). So, this tree should be moved to/merged with your patch folder resulting that, e.g., the /patch-optional/usr/sbin/quicksetup file replaces your existing /usr/sbin/quicksetup file (you can check it after Puli boots up).
There is nothing yet in the patch-bugfix folder.

Are you asking me to state which of options a,b,c,d,e,B,C,D I prefer?

Yes... I recognized that what I introduced as a kind request seems to be a statement. So, I clarified it in my above post (see the green color text).

Have fun!

Regards,

gjuhasz

[Sylvander]

1. "...smartsave and usr (the latter has the sbin subfolder with a modified quicksetup file). So, this tree should be moved to/merged with your patch folder..."
a. I tried to download these 2 folders [complete with all sub-folder/file tree content] to my /mnt/sdb1/patch folder on my Puli Flash Drive, BUT...
The attempt failed.
b. e.g. I clicked on your http://www.smokey01.com/gjuhasz/Puli-6.0.4_Oct2015/ link and was taken to that folder...
Clicked on the patch-optional/ folder, and was taken to http://www.smokey01.com/gjuhasz/Puli-6.0.4_Oct2015/patch-optional/...
Clicked on the smartsave/ folder [to download it?], and instead of being given a download dialog window, 2 sub-folders were displayed that had red exclamation symbols against them.
I didn't see any right-click context meu items that seemed suitable either.
c. So how should I download the necessary?

[gjuhasz]

The attempt failed.

Oops... you are right... Only I can download uncompressed folder structure from my site but this needs my password...

So, I re-organized the support feature.

Now, a couple of optional updates are available in form of compressed packages at

http://www.smokey01.com/gjuhasz/Puli-6. ... 15/updates

Readme and appropriate control sum files have been uploaded, too.

Sorry for the inconvenience.

Have fun!

Regards,

gjuhasz

[Sylvander]

1. "The compressed packages in this folder should be unpacked to your boot device (USB pendrive) one-by-one."
Package Files =
20151102-optional.tar.gz
20151103-optional.tar.gz
a. First I tried [and initially failed] to do this within Puli.
I think the 1st file was downloaded to /spot/downloads but I couldn't find such a folder [I'm unaccustomed to working as user = "spot"]...
Finally found the file methinks, in /root/spot/downloads...
Is that the correct place to where the downloads should go?
[i.e. when working as spot : how to turn that off?]
Anyway...
b. I decided to work within Slacko, and downloaded both files to /mnt/sdb1 and they are there now that I've rebooted back into Puli.
I'd normally use Xfe to unpack such .tar.gz files, but to where aught I to unpack them?
"Unpack here" in Xfe = /mnt/sdb1
I can tell Xfe to unpack to anywhere I like.
I'll hold off doing anything until you advise me.

[gjuhasz]

/root/spot/downloads... Is that the correct place to where the downloads should go?

Yes, it is. Configured in Google Chrome

...when working as spot : how to turn that off?

By default, Chrome refuses to start as root. However it accepts the preferred non-root user of Puppy Linux - spot (despite of its home folder is /root/spot). You cannot turn this off for Chrome.
Firefox can be started both as root or spot user. A good alternative is Opera which runs as root by default. You can download and install my firefox.pet and/or opera_12.16.1860_i386.pet packages from http://www.smokey01.com/gjuhasz/packages. But anyway, my preference is Chrome and spot.

I'd normally use Xfe to unpack such .tar.gz files, but to where aught I to unpack them?
"Unpack here" in Xfe = /mnt/sdb1
I can tell Xfe to unpack to anywhere I like.
I'll hold off doing anything until you advise me.

To prevent adding unnecessary kilobytes to your backup file, I propose moving such downloaded stuff into a "neutral" place, let's say, into /tmp/ folder. Then do the following:

• 1. In the /tmp folder, right-click on 20151102-optional.tar.gz and select UExtract in the pop-up menu. Choose the /tmp folder as output directory. Click OK.
  2. A new /tmp/20151102-optional.tar.gz_extracted folder is created. Open it. You will see a patch folder there.
  3. Click on your sdb1 drive icon. Among others, you will see a patch folder there, too.
  4. Drag the patch folder in the /tmp/20151102-optional.tar.gz_extracted window then drop it at an empty area of the /mnt/sdb1 window (i.e., not onto a folder). Answer Yes to all questions.

Then repeat the above procedure for 20151103-optional.tar.gz, too. In this case, the contents of the patch (again!) and the profiles folder will be merged with their counterpart on the pendrive.
I don't know how Xfe works but note that some utilities, e.g. XArchive uncompress the archive file directly into the actual folder. In contrast, others, such as UExtract, create a *_extracted destination folder first.

Have fun!

Regards,

gjuhasz

[Sylvander]

1. "4. Drag the patch folder in the /tmp/20151102-optional.tar.gz_extracted window then drop it at an empty area of the /mnt/sdb1 window (i.e., not onto a folder). Answer Yes to all questions."
a. Having completed your steps 1,2,3...
And...
b. Whilst attempting to complete the above quoted step 4, using 2 ROX windows:
b1. I dragged and dropped the patch folder into an empty space in /mnt/sdb1...
b2. I was presented with an option window with 3 choices, and chose to "Move" the patch folder to its new location.
b3. I was warned that the patch folder already existed, and I chose to over-write it, and any matching contents.
b4. It was reported that this completed with 1 error. I don't know what that error was.
b5. The source patch directory still exists in its original location = hasn't moved?
b6. How should I check if all is well = the move [or copy portion of the move?] has indeed completed?

c. If the changes completed...
Will they be permanent?
Or will I need to make a new backup that includes the changes?
Any such new backup would be auto-restored during startup.
I won't make a new backup unless advised to do so.

[gjuhasz]

It was reported that this completed with 1 error. I don't know what that error was.

I could reproduce the behavior. The error comes from how ROX (mis)interprets the move function. Please repeat with copy - nothing should be reverted before this. Selecting copy instead of move prevents the error message.

If the changes completed...
Will they be permanent?
Or will I need to make a new backup that includes the changes?
Any such new backup would be auto-restored during startup.
I won't make a new backup unless advised to do so.

The changes will be permanent. No need for extra backup. The /tmp folder is excluded from backup, so deleting the source folder adds no value there.

Have fun!

Regards,

gjuhasz

[Sylvander]

Well...
a. All of that appears to have completed successfully.
b. It was really quite easy to do.
c. Used ROX and UExtract as per your instructions.

d. How should I confirm that all changes have completed as they aught?
Having rebooted, I've failed to notice any differences.

[gjuhasz]

How should I confirm that all changes have completed as they aught? Having rebooted, I've failed to notice any differences.

• 1. Download the actual dev. version (v48) of Google Chrome from https://www.google.com/chrome/browser/d ... devchannel
  2. Click on the .deb file (at /root/spot/Downloads) to install Chrome.
  3. Wait a few seconds until the "... successfully installed" message appears, then click on the browse icon.

If Chrome does normally open (notice that some icons are black in this version), this confirms that the optional Puli update has been completed successfully.

You may roll back to the stable Chrome (v44) by clicking on its .deb file in your Packages folder. Note that the user can such easily switch between different Chrome versions in Puli This is a unique feature, e.g., Ubuntu, Fedora, etc., cannot do this.

Concerning the other optional Puli update (20151102), try to untick the "Also in future sessions" box in the Session Setup dialog, when it appears after bootup. Then click OK and check that the puli.cfg file was updated immediately on the pendrive (i.e., you see nextsession=no there).

Have fun!

Regards,

gjuhasz

[Sylvander]

1. "Concerning the other optional Puli update (20151102), try to untick the "Also in future sessions" box in the Session Setup dialog, when it appears after bootup. Then click OK and check that the puli.cfg file was updated immediately on the pendrive (i.e., you see nextsession=no there). "
Successfully completed.

2. "1. Download the actual dev. version (v48) of Google Chrome from https://www.google.com/chrome/browser/d ... devchannel
2. Click on the .deb file (at /root/spot/Downloads) to install Chrome.
3. Wait a few seconds until the "... successfully installed" message appears, then click on the browse icon.
If Chrome does normally open (notice that some icons are black in this version), this confirms that the optional Puli update has been completed successfully."
a. Did all of the above, AND...
a1. Chrome did indeed open normally.
But...
a2. The version info displayed at chrome://chrome/ [in the address window] reads: Version 46.0.2490.80
In your opinion, should I use this version or revert to the stable version = v44?
a3. What about /mnt/sdb1/packages/google-chrome-stable_44.0.2403.157_i386.deb being auto-loaded during startup?
Will the 2 versions clash?

[gjuhasz]

The version info displayed at chrome://chrome/ [in the address window] reads: Version 46.0.2490.80
In your opinion, should I use this version or revert to the stable version = v44?
a3. What about /mnt/sdb1/packages/google-chrome-stable_44.0.2403.157_i386.deb being auto-loaded during startup?
Will the 2 versions clash?

For some funny reason, you have downloaded the latest stable version... It is OK but inadequate for verifying whether Puli swaps between dev/beta/stable versions.
If you click on the link in my previous post, Puli should download the current dev (i.e., unstable) version, See the picture attached.
So, I recommend to test this unstable version first.
Something about stable versions v44 vs v46:
v44 is quicker and allows using your camera/mic for webRTC protocol. In contrast, they are blocked in v46 in which some bugs have been fixed. Enabling video/audio is planned by Google in future versions only.

• How to play with webRTC in Chrome?
  Ensure that Chrome v44 is installed then click the red phone icon. Chrome opens offering a free and nice webRTC communication website where text / video / audio / conference chats are available without any registration. Similar to Firefox Hello... but at the moment Firefox Hello can only be used for a direct conversation between two people.

You can decide which version you prefer. You can download any Chrome version and move their .deb file from /root/spot/Downloads to /mnt/sdb1/packages folder but in this case you need to change the text in your smartload file(s), for example, to smartload the current stable version, the relevant rows should look like this:

- google-chrome-stable_44
google-chrome-stable_current
- google-chrome-unstable_current

Concerning your preference to backup the system on daily basis: Puli excludes any smartloaded package from the backups therefore I propose resist backing up your system after the above verification game or at least delete the /opt/google folder before shutting down with backup...

Have fun!

Regards,

gjuhasz

[tallboy]

Hi gjuhasz, congratulations on an exciting Puppy! I have downloaded it, but not yet installed it to a USB stick. I usually run my puppys from a live CD, and save to a harddisk, whitout anything but 2 partitions for storage on it - no OS. I backup to 2 USB sticks (I have learnt the hard way!).
You have made an impressively detailed help-file - I wish all other puppys could have one like it, but my brain is running in slow-mode, so I have a couple of questions anyway.
If I understand correctly, I can modify Puli to include specific setup files for several PCs, to be loaded at startup? And after I load Puli, I can remove the USB stick and continue to work, much like I use the live CD? Do I have to insert the stick again before quitting a session? Why does the stick ideally have to be 4Gb? How big is an extracted Puli on the stick? Can the stick be formatted in for example ext2, or do I have to use Fat32?
I make necessary saves to the HDD all the time, and after backup is done, I usually just turn off the PC when a live CD session is finished, whithout using any Save options in the puppy. If what I described is correct, I can more or less treat the USB stick as a live CD. I don't have to write to the USB stick very often, or at all after the first setup, and the stick is much smaller than a cd. Hmmm....

View the evolution in storage media, the large USB stick is my very first at 128Mb, the tiny one is 8Gb, but they come in 64Gb as well...

tallboy

[Sylvander]

1. "For some funny reason, you have downloaded the latest stable version... It is OK but inadequate for verifying whether Puli swaps between dev/beta/stable versions.
If you click on the link in my previous post, Puli should download the current dev (i.e., unstable) version, See the picture attached.
So, I recommend to test this unstable version first."
a. I did indeed click on the link you provided, then clicked on the "Download Chrome" button...
The option button = 32 bit .deb (For Debian/Ubuntu) was selected, and that seemed OK to me, so I clicked the "Accept and install" button.
Was this wrong?
Could you give instructions on how to get to the correct version?

[gjuhasz]

I did indeed click on the link you provided, then clicked on the "Download Chrome" button...
The option button = 32 bit .deb (For Debian/Ubuntu) was selected, and that seemed OK to me, so I clicked the "Accept and install" button.
Was this wrong?
Could you give instructions on how to get to the correct version?

The stable version of Chrome you downloaded is OK. Stable versions are correct any time.
However, when I click on that link, it takes me to a Google Chrome Terms of Service page, then, after I accept the terms, to the download site of the dev version https://www.google.com/chrome/browser/t ... l&statcb=1 from where I can download the dev (unstable) version as you see in the picture attached to my previous post.
Similarly, I can download beta version (google-chrome-beta_current_i386.deb) finally from https://www.google.com/chrome/browser/t ... l&statcb=1

Maybe the laws/regulations at your location restrict the downloadable content, i.e., allow downloading the stable version only, even if the link seems to be different.

Have fun!

Regards,

gjuhasz

[gjuhasz]

Dear tallboy,

Thanks for testing Puli.

If I understand correctly, I can modify Puli to include specific setup files for several PCs, to be loaded at startup?

Fortunately, the current Linux systems recognize the host settings appropriately. Despite the answer to your question is "yes", the smartload options of Puli can also be used for setting up different work environment on the same machine.
For example, I hit the "a" key during bootup which provides me the core Puli with different add-ons in form of .pet and sfs files. Some packages among them need specific license keys - I place the keys into a strongly encrypted pet package, too.
My son hits "m" to set up a MInecraft game environment for himself. It is configured to save his game data to /mnt/sda1 at the end of the game. He uses a slightly different settings for MInecraft (by simply hitting "n") to play with his friend at their home, resulting that the friend's hard disk remains intact - and so on.

And after I load Puli, I can remove the USB stick and continue to work, much like I use the live CD?

Yes, of course.

Do I have to insert the stick again before quitting a session?

Plugging-in the pendrive is needed only if you select either Save:smart or Save:backup at shutdown time. Puli will ask you to do this in time, so you don't accidentally lose your data.

Why does the stick ideally have to be 4Gb? How big is an extracted Puli on the stick?

I have installed Puli on various size of sticks from 1GB to 8 GB. I propose 4 GB because this size is enough for storing many packages that can be smartloaded in different combinations and can also store game data. Sizes of 1-2 GB may be slower and too small for storing game data. Bigger sizes are "too big", i.e., the more value I put on a tiny piece of hardware, the easier to lose it...

In general, the size of each Puli backup file is about 10 MB plus the amount of data you created / added during the your session, i.e., the pet files you installed, documents or game data added. The smartloaded packages, the sfs files, the content of the /tmp folder, the actual security profile, and some unnecessary pieces of content are excluded from backups. Note that you can create many versions of the backup script and, by hitting a key at boot time, select the most appropriate one for your actual session...

The extracted size of Puli depends on the total size of the smartloaded packages. It's about 800 MB by default. However, due to the special memory handling methods built in the Linux kernel, the memory will be populated soon. See, for example, http://www.linuxhowtos.org/System/Linux ... gement.htm

Note that the kernel reserves about the half of the memory for swapping unless you have swap file(s) on the hard drive(s). To mitigate this, consider using the

Code: Select all

sysctl vm.swappiness=x

command if you boot Puli on an unknown machine. (This control is used to define how aggressive the kernel will swap memory pages. In the above command, the applicable range for x is 0...100. Higher values will increase agressiveness, lower values decrease the amount of swap. The default value is 60.)

Can the stick be formatted in for example ext2, or do I have to use Fat32?

I prefer FAT32 because this way I can use the same pendrive in Windows. But, afaik, some users have Puli on an ext2 stick. Ask forum member Sylvander, for example.

I make necessary saves to the HDD all the time, and after backup is done, I usually just turn off the PC when a live CD session is finished, whithout using any Save options in the puppy. If what I described is correct, I can more or less treat the USB stick as a live CD. I don't have to write to the USB stick very often, or at all after the first setup, and the stick is much smaller than a cd. Hmmm....

In Puli, you can select the Don't save option at shutdown to let your pendrive sleeping in your pocket.

Let me have an additional note. Beyond the huge speed difference at boot and shutdown times, there are other advantages of Puli compared to the live CD. As far as I remember, you can only access an older session stored on the live CD if you delete the rest in between. (Forgive me if there has been any advance in this behavior since I last used a Live CD a few years ago). In contrast, the timestamped backup files of Puli allow you to restore any previous status without any restriction. Moreover, in Puli, you can cumulate backups that were created at different times.

Have fun!

Regards,

gjuhasz

[Sylvander]

...some users have Puli on an ext2 stick. Ask forum member Sylvander...

My Puli is on an ext4 partition.
...Therefore I had to use a different installation method to that explained by gjuhasz...
e.g. In a 2nd Puppy = Slacko-5.7.0-pae...
I used "Menu->Setup->Grub4Dos" to install that bootloader after I'd copied all the Puli files to the partition I'd made using GParted.

[tallboy]

Thank you both for the feedback.
I have a large swap partition on each of my harddisks, but thank you for the swapiness command, that one was new to me.

I am not a gamer, (although I did play Pong once back in the early '80s... ) so I'll try to load Puli onto my old 1Gb stick.

If I don't have to use Fat32, I'll use ext2 as usual. I have never been a windoze user, I used Mac before switching to Linux some 15 years ago.

You may both have some interest in the info made available in this thread, for gjuhasz it may contain material worth mentioning in the help-file:
Which FS for new USB memory sticks?

Sylvander, I would be greateful if you could go through he details (if there are more) in the use of Grub, I have always used Lilo on harddisks before.

gjuhasz, I can access the previus sessions on the live CD at any time, I just mount the disk and open whatever I want, see this old photo from another thread. I actually don't use the multisession possibility as much as I thought I would, because reading all those dirs delay the bootup process. I am often on a PC without net, and then I use a multisession DVD with a compact puppy, and lot of programs stored on a separate session, which is not loaded at bootup. I can then mount it at any time, and install anything from that session in a few seconds. I will test Puli to see if it is as usable offline as my DVDs.

I'll report back on my progress..

tallboy