dogone wrote:
Puppy is a very developer-centric distribution (Barry's legacy) so developers will always be at it's core. I suggest that we establish a term-limited group (size ?) consisting of our best developers and our most productive thinkers. A term limit will permit us to tap more community brains over time while discouraging non-productive behavior. Guidance of New Puppy will probably have to be somewhat less democratic at the start so "the group" can get focused and find direction. All input will be welcome but the process must be orderly - more like Barry's blog and less like the forum. In time, perhaps more will be decided in the forum and less in the blog.
We must also plan strategic alliances with other distros and development efforts. Puppy has been too isolated in this regard. Partnering is a powerful tool and ideas must be traded like beads.
Well I read all you had to say and I must admit Your very "developer" orientated, Thats not the case for puppy anymore. Originally with Barry when he first started puppy 5yrs ago, yes it was, During puppy 1,2 yes it was, During 3 & 4 things changed. I was around for 1 (Just tried it out for a few weeks when it was released) Then the 2 series came out much better new programs etc. But then 3.0 came out which was based on Slackware sources plus puppy's added flare as we know. Then 4 came out. With 3 &4 No real new applications made by "Developers" Just updated fixes, that happen from start to finish of a series, Actually puppy 4 biggest noticeable change was the gtk2 theme and the update puppy manager. Oh and the Qt4 change. Same basic applications, well Seamonkey mail was dropped Sylpheed was added, but still not a developer thing. I compiled QT4 last week myself and released for puppy, I've made more complicated themes, I probably could of hacked the puppy package manager also and made it look like that or even added graphics to it. BUT guess what ??? I'm Not a developer and would be left out of your loop, So would WhoDo, Lobster, Sir Duncan, John Biles and many, many others etc. I think we really need to get off this developer Idea way of thinking. You'll be closing a lot of doors with that attitude.
Truly a developer is someone you can go to and say " I need an application built which can do this .... Show me a prototype in a few days" Puppy has what 4 maybe 5 who could do that,
But ask yourself
Do you have to be a developer to build puppy??? NO
Do you have to a developer update puppy NO
Do you need to be a developer to Change the way puppy runs? example, window manager replacement ? NO
Do need to be a developer to build graphics ? NO
Do you need to be a developer to install and remove applications? NO
Do you need to be a developer to compile packages? NO
Do you need to be a developer to find Bugs and Fixes? NO
Do you need to be a developer to get Gnome working on puppy by compiling sources? NO
Do you need to be a developer to get KDE working on puppy by compiling sources? NO
Do you need to be a developer to build and update websites and manage networks? NO
Do you need to be a developer to build pet and sfs packages? NO
Now lets look at the developer side
They make and maintain applications (my applications are pitiful compared to a real developers, Like Zigbert, He does excellent work)
They compile kernels and they do the above also, and in Barry's case he managed also and built a reusable framework and do most of it:)
The only reason why I broke the list down that way is that I was told I wasn't a developer this week in the forum, Tell you the truth, I never figured I was in the first place, but ALL those NO's you read up there I can do and a lot of non Developers like myself can do also.
Barry made a reusable base for puppy, by what you said, no new kernels, That just means from the developers side of things, fixes and patches, that happens all the time durring a regular cycle. but from the non-developers side of things, probably most of those "NO's" will be used in future 4.0 releases.
The cold hard fact is, right now you have developers and almost developers or junior developers, what ever you call it. You shut the doors on their faces and well I just don't know, your going to hurt a lot of feelings and lose a lot of talent if you think "DEVELOPERS" are the only ones to make decisions, also come to think of it developers aren't professional graphic designers, web developers, Networking managers. etc Theres a lot more to puppy then just developers its called a community, Lets keep it that way.
To the Developers, I'm not trying to step on your toes, But I'm tired of everyone else thinking they can step on mine. Developers are a huge importance in any Linux distro, Without your previous work and current work we wouldn't be here chatting in this forum. I have all the respect in the world for developers, all my applications I use everyday hardware software etc is all developers and I'm very grateful of it. But sometimes the overlooked has to be looked at when making decisions. Together united we can make a better puppy.
ttuuxxx