Top 1% Getting Richer (who would have guessed?)
http://money.cnn.com/2011/10/26/news/ec ... &hpt=hp_t1
and Wary Puppy just ROCKS!
Capitalism
Capitalism
Things are not what they appear to be: nor are they otherwise.
Surangama Sutra
Surangama Sutra
"...overall decline in productivity?" Wtf does that mean? Like because Jobs was rich he wasn't productive? Or does that just apply to "average" people who don't understand how to be rich because they are stupid?
Am I misunderstanding you? Apologies if I am.
Am I misunderstanding you? Apologies if I am.
Things are not what they appear to be: nor are they otherwise.
Surangama Sutra
Surangama Sutra
It's going to be hard to compete financially with Steve Jobs if you can't read or write:
"Disturbing fact: 42 million Americans suffer functional illiteracy according to the National Right to Read Foundation. They cannot read, write or perform simple math. Another 50 million Americans cannot read past the 4th grade level."
"Even our social services, welfare, food stamps and free lunch programs cannot keep up with the sheer magnitude of America’s new poor class. Another 43 million Americans subsist on food stamps because they lack the educational skills to secure a job. (Source: Reuters News Services)"
"The fact that there will be a shortage of seven million properly educated workers by 2012 will do nothing to help with prosperity or recovery. This figure, which was reported in a study from Columbia University, accompanies other troubling numbers, like a $192 billion total loss in potential wages from workers without a high school diploma."
"Disturbing fact: 42 million Americans suffer functional illiteracy according to the National Right to Read Foundation. They cannot read, write or perform simple math. Another 50 million Americans cannot read past the 4th grade level."
"Even our social services, welfare, food stamps and free lunch programs cannot keep up with the sheer magnitude of America’s new poor class. Another 43 million Americans subsist on food stamps because they lack the educational skills to secure a job. (Source: Reuters News Services)"
"The fact that there will be a shortage of seven million properly educated workers by 2012 will do nothing to help with prosperity or recovery. This figure, which was reported in a study from Columbia University, accompanies other troubling numbers, like a $192 billion total loss in potential wages from workers without a high school diploma."
The U.S. has one major political that thinks government is bad, and does its best to prove it whenever it gets the chance. Half of the other major political party (including the president) thinks the first party has some good ideas , even though the first party has been wrong about everything for the last 75 years, and in the last 30 has gotten even worse. So it's no wonder things aren't going so well here.
the education system is fucked AKA dumbing down.
some businesses did a study to find out way the 60s hippy movement happened, they found better educated people aren't satisfied with shit jobs.
I can't remember the exact statistics but America (one of the wealthiest countries) scores low in Maths and English on an international level.
some businesses did a study to find out way the 60s hippy movement happened, they found better educated people aren't satisfied with shit jobs.
I can't remember the exact statistics but America (one of the wealthiest countries) scores low in Maths and English on an international level.
Ok, I'll Bite. One can become educated, have a good work ethic, and still be kept down by cronyismThings are not what they appear to be: nor are they otherwise.
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/cronyism
Whether it be the private sector,public sector, whether racially motivated, or one trying to keep down their replacement which they consider a threat to their job. This is also referred to as "the good ol boy network". In life. I have seen this implemented by All Races and Cultures in positions of management. It also is a us vs them type mind set.
Capitalism does not always mean that the cream always rises to the top, people being what they are.
So blaming the lack of education is not the total picture here IMHO. The rich get richer because they are experts at maintaining "the good ol boy network".
Nuff said here, Rok
1. The Capitalist/Religious/Monarchist trinity evolved such that it discovered/decided that a hierarchical structure is most secure/stable.
Just like on the Chess board.
Each layer [with King at the top] is protected by the larger layer below [metaphorically].
In reality it didn't necessarily/always work quite like that, see 2 below.
Naturally there must be a reward to each individual for functioning well in his/her part within the hierarchy, otherwise why would each remain true.
This is where [Religious] propaganda and belief can help.
Some may stay true, even if not rewarded with the good life.
2. Then you have the problem that "all power corrupts, and absolute power corrupts absolutely".
This I believe is where one particular function of the belief in God, and the power of the religious institution came into play.
(a) The Monarch was expected to consider himself, and be, subservient to God, and therefore to his representatives on earth, the Church.
(b) If this worked as it aught, the church would moderate any tendency to excess by the monarch.
(c) Often didn't work...
Their great power corrupted the church leadership.
Basically...the nearer you come to the seat of power, the greater the attraction for the unscrupulous, the greater the tendency to be or become corrupt.
3. The problem any leader has...
[Not that I have any 1st-hand experience of this]
Is to protect himself by surrounding himself with subordinates he can trust.
(a) Is this why monarchs invented the left and right wings?
I imagine him choosing his most trusted "right-hand-man" to stand beside his sword arm [least likely to grab and hold his arm so an assassin could strike].
(b) By extension, he chooses all his "right-hand-men" to form his "right-wing" in the ranks of army in battle [and elsewhere].
(c) Then when in battle, with King-A fighting King-B...
Each right wing [better armed, provisioned, trained, etc] would be fighting [and have the advantage over] the left wing of the other.
Hence, each right-wing would take fewer casualties/deaths, and each left wing take more.
Hence, by this cunning arrangement, each left-wing would be culled, resulting in an increase in the relative numbers of trusted men, and decrease in the number of untrusted men.
(d) Another method is to send the least trusted men on missions that have a low probability of survival [suicide missions?]
3. Such techniques are likely to apply in any kind of society, but particularly if it is hierarchical.
4. Can anyone quote historical examples of the above in action?
Just like on the Chess board.
Each layer [with King at the top] is protected by the larger layer below [metaphorically].
In reality it didn't necessarily/always work quite like that, see 2 below.
Naturally there must be a reward to each individual for functioning well in his/her part within the hierarchy, otherwise why would each remain true.
This is where [Religious] propaganda and belief can help.
Some may stay true, even if not rewarded with the good life.
2. Then you have the problem that "all power corrupts, and absolute power corrupts absolutely".
This I believe is where one particular function of the belief in God, and the power of the religious institution came into play.
(a) The Monarch was expected to consider himself, and be, subservient to God, and therefore to his representatives on earth, the Church.
(b) If this worked as it aught, the church would moderate any tendency to excess by the monarch.
(c) Often didn't work...
Their great power corrupted the church leadership.
Basically...the nearer you come to the seat of power, the greater the attraction for the unscrupulous, the greater the tendency to be or become corrupt.
3. The problem any leader has...
[Not that I have any 1st-hand experience of this]
Is to protect himself by surrounding himself with subordinates he can trust.
(a) Is this why monarchs invented the left and right wings?
I imagine him choosing his most trusted "right-hand-man" to stand beside his sword arm [least likely to grab and hold his arm so an assassin could strike].
(b) By extension, he chooses all his "right-hand-men" to form his "right-wing" in the ranks of army in battle [and elsewhere].
(c) Then when in battle, with King-A fighting King-B...
Each right wing [better armed, provisioned, trained, etc] would be fighting [and have the advantage over] the left wing of the other.
Hence, each right-wing would take fewer casualties/deaths, and each left wing take more.
Hence, by this cunning arrangement, each left-wing would be culled, resulting in an increase in the relative numbers of trusted men, and decrease in the number of untrusted men.
(d) Another method is to send the least trusted men on missions that have a low probability of survival [suicide missions?]
3. Such techniques are likely to apply in any kind of society, but particularly if it is hierarchical.
4. Can anyone quote historical examples of the above in action?
Last edited by Sylvander on Thu 27 Oct 2011, 13:36, edited 1 time in total.
I'm saying both. People are people no matter what social society is in governance. Unless a rethink is done on how people treat each other. Nothing ever changes. Quoting the Who.darkcity wrote:are you saying that capitalism promotes cronyism. or cronyism is just as bad in any society?
We'll be fighting in the streets
With our children at our feet
And the morals that they worship will be gone
And the men who spurred us on
Sit in judgment of all wrong
They decide and the shotgun sings the song
I'll tip my hat to the new constitution
Take a bow for the new revolution
Smile and grin at the change all around me
Pick up my guitar and play
Just like yesterday
And I'll get on my knees and pray
We don't get fooled again
Don't get fooled again
Change it had to come
We knew it all along
We were liberated from the fall that's all
But the world looks just the same
And history ain't changed
'Cause the banners, they all flown in the last war
I'll tip my hat to the new constitution
Take a bow for the new revolution
Smile and grin at the change all around me
Pick up my guitar and play
Just like yesterday
And I'll get on my knees and pray
We don't get fooled again
Don't get fooled again
No, no!
I'll move myself and my family aside
If we happen to be left half alive
I'll get all my papers and smile at the sky
For I know that the hypnotized never lie
Do ya?
There's nothing in the street
Looks any different to me
And the slogans are replaced, by-the-bye
And the parting on the left
Is now the parting on the right
And the beards have all grown longer overnight
I'll tip my hat to the new constitution
Take a bow for the new revolution
Smile and grin at the change all around me
Pick up my guitar and play
Just like yesterday
Then I'll get on my knees and pray
We don't get fooled again
Don't get fooled again
No, no!
YAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH!
Meet the new boss
Same as the old boss
so you are saying cronyism is the main problem - the solution being to treat each other better. that capitalism makes no different.
I would say capitalism promotes peoples worst traits like greed for example. In other societies there would still be greed but its effect would be reduced. the same with cronyism.
I would say capitalism promotes peoples worst traits like greed for example. In other societies there would still be greed but its effect would be reduced. the same with cronyism.
No.so you are saying cronyism is the main problem
There is no main problem per se. Human nature being what it is from person to person. Because not every one is the same. Some are kind. Some are mean. Some have empathy. Some are Sadists.So blaming the lack of education is not the total picture here IMHO.
We are just animals after all. Just animals with a few certain tricks up our sleeves. Cronyism has probably been around since caveman days. Greed also.
The only thing that has changed is times are more sophisticated. I am one that subscribes to The Zeitgeist Movement train of thought vs Capitalism.
No room for greed or cronyism with that philosophy. Doubt I will live to see it come about in my lifetime though. People being what they are. Giving up the "what about me" train of thought is impossible for a lot of folks.
From one extreme4. Can anyone quote historical examples of the above in action?
http://www.logos-publishing.com/Hitlerjugend-2.htm
to another
http://www.jihadwatch.org/2011/05/our-m ... die-b.html
From Africa (12 year olds with AK-47) to Asia (Sri Lanka civil war). Cannon Fodder has always been easy to find.
Edit: Even if you look at what the American military grunt comes from. He is from a modest background while the privileged youth hangs out at Starbucks.
OK, now I'm getting what your post is about...the ideas of a group you subscribe to.rokytnji wrote:
The only thing that has changed is times are more sophisticated. I am one that subscribes to The Zeitgeist Movement train of thought vs Capitalism.
No room for greed or cronyism with that philosophy. Doubt I will live to see it come about in my lifetime though. People being what they are. Giving up the "what about me" train of thought is impossible for a lot of folks.
"Founded in 2008, The Zeitgeist Movement is a Sustainability Advocacy Organization which conducts community based activism and awareness actions through a network of Global/Regional Chapters, Project Teams, Annual Events, Media and Charity Work"
"The Movement, the defining goal here is the installation of a new socioeconomic model based upon technically responsible Resource Management, Allocation and Distribution through what would be considered The Scientific Method of reasoning problems and finding optimized solutions."
Another "One World Order" movement that is going to solve the world's problems "scientifically."
"The intermediate goal is to obtain a worldwide movement, essentially unifying the people, regardless of country, religion or political party, with a common value identification that we all invariably share, pertaining to our survival and sustainability."
Exactly why the "euro" experiment is failing....attempting to adopt a one size fits all political solution across a group of cultures with strongly differing values and ideologies.
Nice, why work? Let's mechanize:
"..therefore, it is not only negligent for us to waste our lives waiting tables, working at a bus station, fixing cars, or other repetitive, monotonous jobs, it is also entirely irresponsible for us not to apply modern mechanization techniques to all industries possible for, apart from strategic resource management, this is a powerful way to achieve balance and abundance for all the world's people, reducing crime generating imbalances " [sic]
This is the "loss of productivity" that I referred to earlier. People no longer know how to do anything....they want some central governing authority (whatever you want to call it) to manage their lives and provide all their needs. They don't want to work.
"
Hey guys... have you heard about Chris Martenson´s Crash Course?
http://www.chrismartenson.com/crashcourse
Please read it or watch it, I advise, it´s loooong, very long, but clear like water especially for people without knoledge about economics.
After that, your points of view will be totally different.
Pay especial attention to the chapters about Energy and Peak Oil.
Regards.
http://www.chrismartenson.com/crashcourse
Please read it or watch it, I advise, it´s loooong, very long, but clear like water especially for people without knoledge about economics.
After that, your points of view will be totally different.
Pay especial attention to the chapters about Energy and Peak Oil.
Regards.
Capitalism? Are these the guys that love Spam but knows to keep a low
profile on it to not get us Politically Correct so angry we smash them
with our John Henry Hammers?
Nah we don't have such in Socialist Sweden. Only Socialists here.
Even our most conservative Party is now a Workers Party. Times change!
profile on it to not get us Politically Correct so angry we smash them
with our John Henry Hammers?
Nah we don't have such in Socialist Sweden. Only Socialists here.
Even our most conservative Party is now a Workers Party. Times change!
I use Google Search on Puppy Forum
not an ideal solution though
not an ideal solution though
I agree with some of what the Zeitgeist films say. However, I think it doesn't allow enough autonomy at the local level. I believe some things need to be agreed at global level, as we have global interests as well as national, regional and local. Also, the resource allocation computer system sounds dangerous as the people who program the people will have great power.
I also agree that we need to learn to treat each other better - evolve socially not just technically. In the second Zeitgeist film it mentions that people's behaviour is greatly effect by their environment, especially when young - even to the extent of having a greater influence than DNA. ie nurture has been under-emphasized compared to nature. This comes down to education and home environment.
I also agree that we need to learn to treat each other better - evolve socially not just technically. In the second Zeitgeist film it mentions that people's behaviour is greatly effect by their environment, especially when young - even to the extent of having a greater influence than DNA. ie nurture has been under-emphasized compared to nature. This comes down to education and home environment.
Sweden has learned from experience, and sets an example for other floundering economies:nooby wrote:Capitalism? Are these the guys that love Spam but knows to keep a low
profile on it to not get us Politically Correct so angry we smash them
with our John Henry Hammers?
Nah we don't have such in Socialist Sweden. Only Socialists here.
Even our most conservative Party is now a Workers Party. Times change!
"The results have been spectacular. After long being a case study in jobless growth (except in the bloated public sector), Sweden has become a big creator of private-sector jobs. The government has narrowed the "tax wedge" that deters employment and whittled away at sickness benefits: Sweden no longer stands out for welfare excesses. The retirement age has risen to 67. Inheritance and wealth taxes have gone. Mr Borg and Mr Reinfeldt believe firmly in ownership as a driver of prosperity."
"Mr Reinfeldt's success has not gone unnoticed abroad. He is a good friend of Britain's David Cameron (he refers to him simply as "David"), who is of a similar age and also in a coalition with liberals. Mr Cameron's government is interested in Sweden's education reforms (Swedish free schools inspired British academies) and health care. Unlike Britain, Sweden is happy to let private schools and hospitals make profits from taxpayer-financed services if outcomes are better."
"Some 40 years after becoming the only continental European country to switch its motoring from left to right, Sweden is making a similar political shift. By 2014 Mr Reinfeldt will have been in power for eight years. Given the economy's strength, few would bet against his winning again. To many on Europe's left, Social Democratic Sweden was once a statist paradise. Now it is the right that looks north for inspiration."
http://www.economist.com/node/18805503