Now this is Linux (comes from Xandros)
but it runs on Windows - can it be installed from Wine
into a fat partition maybe?
The beta is free
http://www.prestomypc.com/
Hey Presto?
Why not puppy?
It IS nothing more than Linux+unetbootin or +Puppy XP installer.
Why do Spalshtop and Presto gets all the attention while it is nothing more than pertty basic stuff.
My computer is already set to run XP or Linux.
Someone with very basic programming skill can make puppy dressed up with our very own Puppy XP installer and anounce it something equvalent o to Splashtop or Presto.
We should call it ThunderPup or BoomPup something.
Puppy should get some more media attention. It desrve it..
Why do Spalshtop and Presto gets all the attention while it is nothing more than pertty basic stuff.
My computer is already set to run XP or Linux.
Someone with very basic programming skill can make puppy dressed up with our very own Puppy XP installer and anounce it something equvalent o to Splashtop or Presto.
We should call it ThunderPup or BoomPup something.
Puppy should get some more media attention. It desrve it..
I think you missed the point, it is not the windows installer it is the boot speed that impresses me. Boot speed may not be important to some people but on nettops it is.
Puppy @ 100 megs boots in over 45 seconds on this machine (frugal install), So 13 seconds on a variety of hardware is impressive. I can boot ubuntu fast as I can boot puppy! I have even modified the init scrip to prevent copying to ram, this shaved only a few seconds off puppy's boot.
I love puppy and use it everyday but I think the boot speed could be improved.
Craig
Puppy @ 100 megs boots in over 45 seconds on this machine (frugal install), So 13 seconds on a variety of hardware is impressive. I can boot ubuntu fast as I can boot puppy! I have even modified the init scrip to prevent copying to ram, this shaved only a few seconds off puppy's boot.
I love puppy and use it everyday but I think the boot speed could be improved.
Craig
I didn't miss the point. I know you are saying you are impressed by the booting speed of Presto which is Xandro distro with windows installer.
And they improved the boot speed.
because Netbootin and Puppy installer for XP are what I use daily, I think it is not too difficult for any person with basic programming skill. So if Puppy people improve Puppy's boot process the same result can be achieved with Puppy.
That IS what I said. I never said Presto's boot speed isn't impressive.
I do know many talented people in this forum can achieve the same thing.
Like you, I do like to have faster boot Puppy. We are on the same side.
Hope this will clear up the misunderstanding.
John S
And they improved the boot speed.
because Netbootin and Puppy installer for XP are what I use daily, I think it is not too difficult for any person with basic programming skill. So if Puppy people improve Puppy's boot process the same result can be achieved with Puppy.
That IS what I said. I never said Presto's boot speed isn't impressive.
I do know many talented people in this forum can achieve the same thing.
Like you, I do like to have faster boot Puppy. We are on the same side.
Hope this will clear up the misunderstanding.
John S
the XP installer should not be able to speed up start.
It just adds a second entry to the XP bootmenu (so it becomes visible).
Like this you can choose to boot XP, or the windows version of grub, from which you can run one or more Puppys.
So as just a second bootloader is added, there should be no advantages concerning speed.
Presto is described in this german article: http://www.pro-linux.de/news/2009/13886.html (use google to translate).
It seems that Presto is a reduced system.
Like Puppy, it comes with some default applications.
As it is optimized for netbooks, it might have less kernelmodules than a large distro or Puppy.
If it has the focus on netbooks, it also might not run all the daemons, that you often find on large systems (also Puppy prefers minimalism here).
I think you can achieve similar results with Puppy, if you use one of the puplets like that for the EEEPC, compile a minimalistic kernel for it, and remove some options from initrd.gz (e.g. it has some timed loops, so that it works with some exotic hardware like Classmate).
Mark
It just adds a second entry to the XP bootmenu (so it becomes visible).
Like this you can choose to boot XP, or the windows version of grub, from which you can run one or more Puppys.
So as just a second bootloader is added, there should be no advantages concerning speed.
Presto is described in this german article: http://www.pro-linux.de/news/2009/13886.html (use google to translate).
It seems that Presto is a reduced system.
Like Puppy, it comes with some default applications.
As it is optimized for netbooks, it might have less kernelmodules than a large distro or Puppy.
If it has the focus on netbooks, it also might not run all the daemons, that you often find on large systems (also Puppy prefers minimalism here).
I think you can achieve similar results with Puppy, if you use one of the puplets like that for the EEEPC, compile a minimalistic kernel for it, and remove some options from initrd.gz (e.g. it has some timed loops, so that it works with some exotic hardware like Classmate).
Mark
[url=http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?p=173456#173456]my recommended links[/url]
SplashTop is different from presto. SplashTop is installed in the BIOS of the machine so it starts loading *very* soon after power on. After that, it does have much in common with presto or other *fastboot* techniques -that is that they have a minimum of software which gets loaded and it is loaded in creative ways which reduce the time needed for it to reach a running state. Many of these techniques are being used by the main distros for running on netbooks or even on regular hardware.
netbook distros do have additional advantages -the hardware is already known and so no hardware detection or setup needs to be done during bootup -no devmapper, no udev, no hotplug, etc. Most of this will not work for a distro meant to be installed on a large variety of hardware. Hardware targeted distros can also benefit from having a smaller kernel -having less modules on-board doesn't make any difference. fastboot netbook distros can hard-link all needed (basic) features into the kernel so no time is lost loading modules. The fact that the basic hardware is known means that all other generally useful kernel features can be left out entirely. Having a smaller kernel makes any installation more agile -these days most kernels are around 2MB or more and there is a great difference in their performance compared to old 2.4 kernels which were commonly around 700-800KB.
The kernel developers and others have done some work over the last 18 months targeted specifically at achieving a 5 second boot time for linux. But some of the techniques currently used are 'cheats', that is they simply delay doing some necessary things until after the desktop has started.
Puppy could certainly benefit from some of these same techniques -a lot of time is wasted while the init scripts run. Eliminating these delays in Puppy would imply reducing some of the flexibility of the init routines -or at least segregating the scripts so that individual types of startups could proceed more quickly. Count the number of 'if' statements in the init scripts for a clue as to where the time goes...
Puppy could also probably boot faster by not loading so much into RAM -the tradeoff would be that individual applications would then take longer to start the first time they are run. Getting a useful balance is quite a trick.
netbook distros do have additional advantages -the hardware is already known and so no hardware detection or setup needs to be done during bootup -no devmapper, no udev, no hotplug, etc. Most of this will not work for a distro meant to be installed on a large variety of hardware. Hardware targeted distros can also benefit from having a smaller kernel -having less modules on-board doesn't make any difference. fastboot netbook distros can hard-link all needed (basic) features into the kernel so no time is lost loading modules. The fact that the basic hardware is known means that all other generally useful kernel features can be left out entirely. Having a smaller kernel makes any installation more agile -these days most kernels are around 2MB or more and there is a great difference in their performance compared to old 2.4 kernels which were commonly around 700-800KB.
The kernel developers and others have done some work over the last 18 months targeted specifically at achieving a 5 second boot time for linux. But some of the techniques currently used are 'cheats', that is they simply delay doing some necessary things until after the desktop has started.
Puppy could certainly benefit from some of these same techniques -a lot of time is wasted while the init scripts run. Eliminating these delays in Puppy would imply reducing some of the flexibility of the init routines -or at least segregating the scripts so that individual types of startups could proceed more quickly. Count the number of 'if' statements in the init scripts for a clue as to where the time goes...
Puppy could also probably boot faster by not loading so much into RAM -the tradeoff would be that individual applications would then take longer to start the first time they are run. Getting a useful balance is quite a trick.
more thought
Sometimes it is wise to learn from others.
Puppy is fast. But I think it could be faster. I have installed Puppy using XP installer. However, whether using XP installer or Live CD, it keeps checking pre-installed Puppy files.
If it is a Live CD, I understand but when it runs from hard drive using XP installer, it shouldn't check the very same machine every time it boots.
If it is the same machine, shouldn't check if there is any changes.
Instead, display option to check if there IS a change possibly caused by defragment, adding other puppies, sfs etc.
If there is anything blocking boot because of some changes made by a user, then stop to ask what to do either reboot or go back to start up menu to choose XP.
I think modifying boot script to skip the checking if it starts from home folder in a hard drive not from CD or USB.
It will save a few second. Booting up Puppy every morning waiting for unnecessary checking could waste a lot of time in the long run.
Also, I would like to say that you gain some, you lose some.
If a fast boot sacrifices some, it is up to the user to choose such way of booting. Some prefer faster but minimum booting, others prefer slow but full loading. I think it should have a menu when starts enable us to choose either method of booting or have separate ISOs.
Above are just my humble opinion. I might be wrong technically.
I am saying all this just for the sake of improving Puppy.
John S
Puppy is fast. But I think it could be faster. I have installed Puppy using XP installer. However, whether using XP installer or Live CD, it keeps checking pre-installed Puppy files.
If it is a Live CD, I understand but when it runs from hard drive using XP installer, it shouldn't check the very same machine every time it boots.
If it is the same machine, shouldn't check if there is any changes.
Instead, display option to check if there IS a change possibly caused by defragment, adding other puppies, sfs etc.
If there is anything blocking boot because of some changes made by a user, then stop to ask what to do either reboot or go back to start up menu to choose XP.
I think modifying boot script to skip the checking if it starts from home folder in a hard drive not from CD or USB.
It will save a few second. Booting up Puppy every morning waiting for unnecessary checking could waste a lot of time in the long run.
Also, I would like to say that you gain some, you lose some.
If a fast boot sacrifices some, it is up to the user to choose such way of booting. Some prefer faster but minimum booting, others prefer slow but full loading. I think it should have a menu when starts enable us to choose either method of booting or have separate ISOs.
Above are just my humble opinion. I might be wrong technically.
I am saying all this just for the sake of improving Puppy.
John S
Fast boot
See
http://moblin.org/projects/fast-boot
Splashtop, Presto, Tinycore, Moblin...
The war for fast boot has began.
P.S. Splashtop reminds me the early days of computing. 30 years ago, I was putting numbers(machine language) into ROMs. Electronically rewritable one. All the arcade machines were booted from ROMS.
There is nothing NEW under the sun.
http://moblin.org/projects/fast-boot
Splashtop, Presto, Tinycore, Moblin...
The war for fast boot has began.
P.S. Splashtop reminds me the early days of computing. 30 years ago, I was putting numbers(machine language) into ROMs. Electronically rewritable one. All the arcade machines were booted from ROMS.
There is nothing NEW under the sun.
you can skip to search files by adding pdev1 and psubdir in Grubs menu.lst.
E.g.:
Mark
E.g.:
Code: Select all
title Puppy 412
root (hd0,0)
kernel /puppy412/vmlinuz acpi=force pmedia=idehd pdev1=sda1 psubdir=puppy412
initrd /puppy412/initrd.gz
[url=http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?p=173456#173456]my recommended links[/url]
Hello, Mark
I think I did something wrong. I changed the menu.lst file. Since the kernel is different, I changed it accordingly.
When I rebooted, I got a message saying;
Searching for Puppyfiles in computer disks.
Pup_412.sfs not found. Dropping out to initial ramdisk console..
/bin/sh;can't access tty, job control turned off.
#
Please take a look at the attached image.
And one more thing, If I change the timeout in the menu.lst to 0, then does Puppy start without delay?
Thanks in advance for your help.
John S
I think I did something wrong. I changed the menu.lst file. Since the kernel is different, I changed it accordingly.
When I rebooted, I got a message saying;
Searching for Puppyfiles in computer disks.
Pup_412.sfs not found. Dropping out to initial ramdisk console..
/bin/sh;can't access tty, job control turned off.
#
Please take a look at the attached image.
And one more thing, If I change the timeout in the menu.lst to 0, then does Puppy start without delay?
Thanks in advance for your help.
John S
- Attachments
-
- stop checking.png
- (77.27 KiB) Downloaded 442 times
I installed presto on an acer desktop Seemed to find all the hardware and the second boot was very quick, under 15 seconds.
Could puppy's boot scripts make a note of hardware on first boot and skip all the scanning on subsequent boots unless directed to scan for new hardware.
A stripped down system should be faster to boot than a bloated Ubuntu, Okay puppy is marginally faster but on my tests it is not much.
Not sure what other tricks Presto uses but it works well.
Craig
Could puppy's boot scripts make a note of hardware on first boot and skip all the scanning on subsequent boots unless directed to scan for new hardware.
A stripped down system should be faster to boot than a bloated Ubuntu, Okay puppy is marginally faster but on my tests it is not much.
Not sure what other tricks Presto uses but it works well.
Craig
-
technosaurus
- Posts: 4853
- Joined: Mon 19 May 2008, 01:24
- Location: Blue Springs, MO
- Contact:
Puppy could boot extremely fast if we only loaded up the minimum for jwm and then hot mounted (dynamically loaded) individual sfs files on first run
This is how I would do it... build the static .jwmrc with the executables
in the lowest order directory (in PATH) put scripts of the same name that load all the required sfs modules and then executes the program...
(this way after they are loaded the higher order program of the same name executes instead)
... but this would obsolete petget and probably go beyond Puppy - maybe a feature of 5.0?
This is how I would do it... build the static .jwmrc with the executables
in the lowest order directory (in PATH) put scripts of the same name that load all the required sfs modules and then executes the program...
(this way after they are loaded the higher order program of the same name executes instead)
... but this would obsolete petget and probably go beyond Puppy - maybe a feature of 5.0?
Check out my [url=https://github.com/technosaurus]github repositories[/url]. I may eventually get around to updating my [url=http://bashismal.blogspot.com]blogspot[/url].
Somewhat succesful
Hello, Mark.
I have tried till today about the boot process you advised.
I now have to conclude this testing with what I've got so far.
I couldn't remove the checking(or searching) completely but I somehow managed to reduce the booting time by making the initial delay to 0 and adding just one of the code not two.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
default 0
timeout 0
title puppy-4.1.2retro-k2.6.21.7-seamonkey
rootnoverify (hd0,0)
kernel (hd0,0)/puppy-4.1.2retro-k2.6.21.7-seamonkey/vmlinuz root=/dev/ram0 PMODE=idehd pdev1=hda1
initrd (hd0,0)/puppy-4.1.2retro-k2.6.21.7-seamonkey/initrd.gz
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I hope this is useful to others.
I have tried till today about the boot process you advised.
I now have to conclude this testing with what I've got so far.
I couldn't remove the checking(or searching) completely but I somehow managed to reduce the booting time by making the initial delay to 0 and adding just one of the code not two.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
default 0
timeout 0
title puppy-4.1.2retro-k2.6.21.7-seamonkey
rootnoverify (hd0,0)
kernel (hd0,0)/puppy-4.1.2retro-k2.6.21.7-seamonkey/vmlinuz root=/dev/ram0 PMODE=idehd pdev1=hda1
initrd (hd0,0)/puppy-4.1.2retro-k2.6.21.7-seamonkey/initrd.gz
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I hope this is useful to others.
-
hartiberlin
- Posts: 67
- Joined: Thu 21 May 2009, 16:13
What is the fastest booting Puplet with the upper
Frugal Grub4dos method ?
I really adore Presto how fast it is booting and
easy to update ?
I really wish I could have a puplet that is as fast
as Presto and comes with a Firefox 3.0.10 browser
with latest Adobe Flash plugin and a nice Mediaplayer
like Kaffeine or VideoLan.
Regards, Stefan.
Frugal Grub4dos method ?
I really adore Presto how fast it is booting and
easy to update ?
I really wish I could have a puplet that is as fast
as Presto and comes with a Firefox 3.0.10 browser
with latest Adobe Flash plugin and a nice Mediaplayer
like Kaffeine or VideoLan.
Regards, Stefan.
[url=http://www.overunity.com]overunity.com open source free energy research forum[/url]
[url=http://www.overunity.de]overunity.de Deutsches free energy research forum[/url]
[url=http://www.overunity.de]overunity.de Deutsches free energy research forum[/url]
That is a feature of Puppy 4. I believe it is set through the bootup manager - wherever it is that you choose additional SFS files to load.iscraigh wrote:I installed presto on an acer desktop Seemed to find all the hardware and the second boot was very quick, under 15 seconds.
Could puppy's boot scripts make a note of hardware on first boot and skip all the scanning on subsequent boots unless directed to scan for new hardware.
A stripped down system should be faster to boot than a bloated Ubuntu, Okay puppy is marginally faster but on my tests it is not much.
Not sure what other tricks Presto uses but it works well.
Craig
Ubuntu 10.10 Maverick
Core 2 Quad 2.4 GHz | 2 GB RAM
Core 2 Quad 2.4 GHz | 2 GB RAM